(360) Sun 21 Feb 88 13:33 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: The 27th Path, Tzaddi, The Moon, The Active or Exciting Intelligence St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:f00e 10556c3a The Moon, the Presence of God in or Mundane world, glows in unulant splendour from New to Full to New... I am as the Moon Our Light is ever changing Healing, gathering The Tzaddik, the Righteous One catches the Splendors of G-d, and illumines Mundane world as the Moon catches the splendours of the Sun. The Moon through his-r aspects runs the world. When the Moon is unaspected, the cat's away and the mice can play...but in another octave the Ultimate, the One is there without interferance from the Moon and wonders can emerge...it is a time to let go and let God and enjoy when the Moon is Void of Course...it is a time to trust in the Grand Ultimate and "know that I am God!" for the is now no mediator between God and Human...not even the Moon. "The Twenty-seventh Path is the Active or Exciting Intellgence and it is so called because every existent being recieves its spirit and motion." Perhaps every esistent being does recieve its spirit and motion through the Moon on the 27th path between Netzach and Hod. --- * Origin: The Terraboard, Minneapolis, MN (Opus 1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (361) Sun 21 Feb 88 13:43 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: The 28th Path, Pices, The Sun, The Natural Intelligence, The Sun St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d8bd 6d761055 5. The Coordinator From its earliest beginnings, the Magick Conference has@EID:f00e 10556d76 Pices the last mysterious sign of the zodiac, signifier of the Age coming to an end, the final sign in the zodiac where the soul is completed and perfected. The Path from Yesod, the Moon, to Netzach, Venus...and the mysterious Venus (the Hidden Intelligence) shows his-r nature and subtle, hidden ways again. The 28th Path is called the Natural Intelligence: by it is completed and perfected the nature of all that exists beneath the Sun. Once again the sychronistic beauty of this system of attribution shows its appropriateness: two children playing in the Sun, Who is mentioned in the Yetziratic Text...two children being purified by the benign Sun. From The Stoned Tarot, Hugh Read, 1968 Thirteen sweet Tears of Mercy Fall from the Sun To feed the Children These are the Children of Life and of Light Coming out of the Earth They are clumsy and gentle And sweetly submissive Deeply dependent on God The Sun Tears Surround them And touch them And heal them and nourish them Fully on Love Touch me with Sun tears Touch me, dear God, Nourish me fully on Love Notice that as we approach the "end" of the paths we are approaching what most think of as the beginning and the paths begin to become more abstract and less personal and mundane. Those who say Malkuth is the mundane world do not notice what the Yetziratic verse covering Malkuth says, ITSELF. They listen to what others say and ignor the words. --- * Origin: The Terraboard, Minneapolis, MN (Opus 1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (362) Mon 22 Feb 88 17:02 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: The 29th, 30th, 31st, 32nd Paths St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:f00e 10568850 "The Twentinineth path is called the Corporeal Intelligence; it informs every body which is incorporated under all orbs, and it is the growth thereof." Judgement covers this Path, with Resh, the Sun: Initiation. From the Stoned Tarot: Miracle of patience: God! Muttering man...childless man...slack, old, naked man,,, Crude woman... Sad child They raise crude arms to Death: Black Sacophegus The seek Joy, hiding in Defeat They are hiding in silent Defeat Release! Fail again...grow again...die again... Faithful, patient, Joyous, Crude, Loving: God! The thirtieth path is called the Collective Intelligence, for thense astrologers, by the judgement of the stars and the heavenly signs, derive their speculations and the perfection of their science according to the motions of the the stars" This path is covered by the World and Tav...and what this path has to do with astrology I do not know...why the World and Tav... The Stoned Tarot: The Two sexted Creature, clothed in Flesh, Benignly dances on. Within a Wreath, with Gold beneath She dances in her mind Angels in their varied forms Sadly watch her cance. They want to see her Faith in God. She dances in her mind Touch, dear God, our Flesh with Faith Touch us with Holy Faith. Faith is all we need, dear God, To dance right out of our minds. Tav indeed! continued --- * Origin: The Terraboard, Minneapolis, MN (Opus 1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (363) Mon 22 Feb 88 17:15 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: More Paths St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:f00e 105689fa ...correction...the thirtieth path is covered by shin, sharper than a serpents tooth...the old ways die hard... The thirty-first path is called the Perpetual Intelligence. Why is it so called? Because it guides the sun and the moon according to their constitution and cases each to gravitate in its respective orb. The thirty-first path is covered by the Fool and Tav. What does the Fool and what does Tav have to do with movement of the sun and the moon...I don't have the slightest idea. Case says this is the path of conscious immortality. Sounds good to me! Perhaps a little alchemy is hidden here. The thirty-second path is called the Assisting Intelligence, because it directs all the operation of the seven planets, with their divisions, and concurs therein. There is only one Aleph in this system, in Kether. There is only one Magician in this system, in Kether. The thirty second path, also called the Administrating Intelligence is void of symbolism, save that which you choose as you travel the path. Perhaps this is where Higher Self abides...or where the Holy Spirit whispers in silence and beauty. Thank you all for bearing with me in this Mercury Retrograde operation which I am bringing to a close now amidst physical confusiong and computer madness. In time to come, I may get this into a presentable form. Now it is a tattered tree of spontaneous thoughts based mostly on the text of the Sepher Yetzirah as fond in A.E. Waite's, The Holy Kabbalah and in Gareth Knights, a Practical Guide to Qabalistic Symolism. Blessed Be and 93 93/93 --- * Origin: The Terraboard, Minneapolis, MN (Opus 1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (364) Mon 22 Feb 88 20:08 By: Brad Hicks To: All Re: Instructions for Cut-Over to MagickNet *** URGENT *** St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:3db6 a10a1056 If you are on a board whose sysop does not read this echo, please insure that he or she reads this message. Thank you. In instituting the changes discussed here recently, I am following Josh Gordon's advice and killing the MAGICK echo area name. If you do not follow these instructions, you will have problems, so please pay attention and ask questions - via crash netmail, as time is short - if you don't understand any thing that follows. STEP ONE - MARCH 1ST "STOP MAKING SENSE" As soon as feasible after midnight on March 1st, every sysop on the Magick echo should change this echo to read-only, if not completely remove it from his or her list of available areas. There's currently about six-day lag time from the far end of the net, which is either in net 107 (NY MetroNet) or 106 (Houston). This will allow the last of the messages in the combined echo, MAGICK, to reach me by the morning of March 7th. STEP TWO - MARCH 1ST TO 7TH "ENTROPY REQUIRES NO MAINTENANCE" Once you have passed up the last packet for the nodes below you, there is no sense in polling anyone just to get the MAGICK echo - as there will be no more packets passed down. While you are waiting, make sure that you have read and understood the file MAG-POL.ARC, the contents of which were also posted to this echo. (Version 1.0 has only cosmetic changes, but is now available from 1:100/523 except during the netmail hour and a half-hour or so either side of it.) Personally, I before I transfer ANY system that polls me (other than the two hubs) to enter a netmail message to me, from its sysop: "I have read and will comply with MAG-POL.TXT, version 1.0." At that time, I will transfer them to the appropriate line in my AREAS.BBS file. I cannot recommend this too strongly to all systems which will carry the new echo, because you will (in event of a worst-case nightmare) be held responsible for the behavior of nodes downstream of you. STEP THREE - MARCH 7TH AND 8TH "LIKE A PHOENIX FROM THE ASHES ..." I will spend almost all of the day on March 7th performing two tasks. First of all, I will manually sort the most recent 600 messages in MAGICK. The best 30 or so (no fixed number, that's just my gut feeling for how it will work out) will be moved to METAPHYSICAL. Then, all message threads directly related to the topics of this echo will be moved to MAGICKNET. The remaining message area will be renamed MUNDANE. Then, to insure that we all start from a common point, the seen-by lines will be removed from all of these messages. That done, I will perform the first ConfMail Export run on the newly born MagickNet Echos. By 11pm or so Central Time, I will have crashed the first packets to AT LEAST the other two hubs, and we will all be distributing it, touch wood, no later than National Mail Hour on the morning of March 8th. If you have stopped POLLing your links in the interim, resume the morning of March 8th (if you are an unreasonable distance down the topology, you may as well wait until the 9th or 10th). And so, no later than March 8th you will need to have removed the MAGICK echo from your system, and modified your echo control files to accomodate the new, improved Neopaganism, Witchcraft, and Magick conference. - Brad Hicks, 1:100/523 MagickNet Coordinator --- Sirius 0.50 * Origin: WeirdBase * St. Louis * 1-314-389-WYRD * (Opus 1:100/523) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (365) Wed 24 Feb 88 0:06 By: L.a. Hussey To: All Re: Ribald Ram Rondeau St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:fbfd 105800d5 (written in traditional trouvere metre; part of a projected series of nine poems, of which 4 are finished, one for each Sabbat, to be set to madrigal music in 4-5 part harmony...) The horned Ram runs high and low, And through the land his influence grows; The Equinox upon us springs With swellings and with moistenings, And pleasant pastime all folk know. The blacksmith's iron hot doth glow; The planter's dibbing stick doth sow; The baker's loaf to th'oven clings. The horny Ram runs high and low, And through the land his influence grows; The Equinox upon us springs! The milkmaid's churn with cream o'erflows; The blossom doth attract the nose; The minstrel's pipe he's fingering. The ploughboy's joyfully ploughing; The shepherd's staff to work doth go. The horned Ram runs high and low, And through the land his influence grows; The Equinox upon us springs With swellings and with moistenings, And pleasant pastime all folk know. (copyright 1988, Leigh Ann Hussey) --- * Origin: ThelemaNet - Hail Eris! * (415) 548-0163 (Opus 1:161/93) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (366) Thu 25 Feb 88 22:17 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Re: Poetry St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:bf7a 1059b225 _The_Cauldron_Chant_ by Ammond ShadowCraft We form the Circle, The Circle most round. We form the Chalice, The Chalice now found. We call the Goddess, to meet the great need. We call the God, To plant His fertile seed. We call the quarters, which we call four. We summon the powers, that contain the force. We stir the Cauldron, from which we were born. We call the Gods, from whom we were torn. We say the words, which lead us round. We pass the kiss, with our lovers found. We face our dreams, in nights psychic flight. We face our hopes, in bright moon of the night. We face our fears, on the Dark Lords Horn. We face our failure, in the Mothers new planted corn. We live our lives, druming and dancing on the meadow. We confront our Death, in the dancing moon light shadow. Our paths run quickly, on fleet foot and wing. Our Circle is joyous, with our Queens and our Kings. Let our little Circle be happy, with Bell, Bowl or Bow. And form now this Circle, with gracious Love, Joy and Hope. BLESSED BE --- * Origin: SMARTNet - WOC'n faster HST (They made me say it!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (367) Sat 27 Feb 88 2:41 By: John Shklov To: Rich Harper Re: Hawaiian Myths St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:e73c 105b1532 Just some loose info re Hawaii/Hawaiian mythology etc...The Hawaiians of old had no written language so everything had to memorized and passed down from teacher to pupil. Comparing chants from different parts of the pacific show amazingly little change took place in this word of mouth process. Some cultures seperated by thousands of years (carbon-dating gives clues as to when migrations took place) have almost identical chants!(recorded when whitey came on the scene ) All knowledge was passed this way..as a result they were a culture of specialists. Each kahuna specialized in a specific aspect of knowledge, be it medicine for healing or for killing or fishing methodology or warfare. They believed in a highself a midself and a low self much as in Hinduism. Different Gods represented different aspects of life and had power over different times of the year and different activities. For example Ku, was the God of war and represented the forces of death. Lono represented the agricultural cycles and the power of life and renewal. In themind of the Hawaiian these were just two aspects of the same totality. Hawaiians had a VERY structured society and a set of rules that MUST be obeyed or one risked death or some worse punishment...eyeball gouging, torture etc..The upper classes got better food and after many generations of superior victuals and intermarriage they became significantly larger and stronger. These upper classes ruled by force and superior warfare skills. One of the special areas of knowledge that the Alii or upper classes concentrated upon was the skills and technology of war. They passed these skills down to their men children. Women were disfranchised and although the bloodlines were passed thru the women they didn't even get to eat at the same mat as men. The Hawaiian mythology got mixed in with western mythology when the missionryscame to bring their word to the PAGANS. As a result even today there are many misconceptions as to what the real beliefs were"pre-contact"as they say. For example, heres a funny story that illustrates that fact; When Fordandder was interviewing Hawaiians last century he asked who built"that" structure and who built "those" walls etc. Tiring of his repeated queries the chief answered "oh it was the mana-hune"(litterally translated it means the "people with little mana or power") Fordenander seized on this response and said "little People", how big were they? were they small? etc etc.... ignorant xtian missionaries. pleasures right under the noses of theiribeThe --- * Origin: Kauai1 - Aloha (Opus 1:12/4) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (368) Sat 27 Feb 88 2:53 By: John Shklov To: Rich Harper Re: Hawaiian Myths-2 St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:fabc 105b16b4 The Hawaiian mythology got mixed in with western mythology when the missionryscame to bring their word to the PAGANS. As a result even today there are many misconceptions as to what the real beliefs were"pre-contact"as they say. For example, heres a funny story that illustrates that fact; When Fordandder was interviewing Hawaiians last century he asked who built"that" structure and who built "those" walls etc. Tiring of his repeated queries the chief answered "oh it was the mana-hune"(litterally translated it means the "people with little mana or power") Fordenander seized on this response and said "little People", how big were they? were they small? etc etc.... he probably was thinking of some western myth such as the Leprechauns...The Hawaiians who loved a joke encouraged this foolishness, laughing to this day behind his back. Even today we have walls and structures said to be built by the "menehunes" and signs that proclaim to the tourists this legend! One last tidbit...The Hawaiian language was high developed (perhps the most highly developed) in the area of lovemaking. They had words to describe every conceivable sexual position and act. The songs they sung had many layers of meaning with a desciption of a pounding wave or a dripping leaf that had explicit meaning with reference to lovemaking as well as its literal meaning. In this way the pleasure loving PAGANS were able to sing about and endorse their pleasures right under the noses of their ignorant xtian missionaries. --- * Origin: Kauai1 - Aloha (Opus 1:12/4) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (369) Mon 29 Feb 88 3:53 By: Tim Maroney To: Ammond Shadowcraft Re: Re: Reclaiming Lucifer St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:954a 105d1ea7 Good message! Every known religion supplanted an earlier religion, and usually some derogatory mythological niche was created for the deities and spirits of the older religion when this happened. In the case of Satan, he is a fusion of our old friend the Horned God (especially in the Pan-form to which he was best known by the Greek-speaking world) and the Judaic mythic figure of Satan from the book of Job. But far from the loyal prosecuting attorney of Job, Satan as formulated to insult pagans was made into an evil nemesis of God, and the exemplar of what to the pain-worshipping Christians was "sin", that is, anything ecstatic and joyful. Satan is constantly telling us to get drunk, pig out on good food, and have sex in the Christians' accounts, to which my reaction is "Amen". I think you have put it very well when you say that "Even though [new pagans] have thrown off the chains of Jehovah they still fear Lucifer. They cringe at the sound of his name." Over and over we hear this shallow refrain, that witches are NOT NOT NOT Satanists, and I think: Why the Hell not? There's more wisdom in any one page of William Blake's overtly Satanic "Marriage of Heaven and Hell" than in the whole corpus of Starhawk's work, after all. (But then, Blake wrote sophisticated and literate poetry, not folk tales, so few neo-pagans have read him.) What are these people so afraid of? Not only are neo-pagans NOT NOT NOT Satanists, they are quite nasty toward anyone who recognizes the deep truth of Satanism. One widely liked member of this board called me a "neurotic Christian-lover" for espousing the reading of Blake and Shaw's Satanic works. Needless to say, no neo-pagan objected. Within the last month a person interested in invoking Lucifer had his account removed by one of the sysops, who said the reason was that "he was extremely abusive"; of course, he didn't mention that the guy started out polite and only became abusive after the aforesaid sysop himself sent some *very* nasty and prejudiced messages to him. Again, zero objection from the neo-pagans. Similar examples abound; but I think things are beginning to loosen up on this front, thanks to people like yourself, and (I like to think) because of my continued pounding on the counter-consensual drum. Tim PS. You called for resources; aside from the Blake, there is Shaw's "The Devil's Disciple", and you might want to check out Campbell's "Masks of God" for more information on the mythic disparagement of older deities such as happened to the Titans in Greek myth and various matriarchal deities. Campbell's sympathies are clearly with the underdog. --- * Origin: ThelemaNet - Hail Eris! * (415) 548-0163 (Opus 1:161/93) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (370) Tue 1 Mar 88 11:54 By: Brad Hicks To: Rowan Moonstone Re: Re: Cult Awareness Week St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:3db6 5ece1061 Actually, back around '77 or so Congress almost passed a definition of a "cult" that was given to them by some religion and philosophy professor from the Ivy League. By that definition, a cult is any religion that accepts or solicits converts from any other religion; the only non-cults are religions (I assume he meant like Judaism or Catholicism) where you're born into it, raised in it, and expected to stay. It was funny as heck to me at the time to see fundamentalist Christians, members of the Unification Church, and pagans bombarding Congress with letters, all taking the same side. But then I've said before that there's about four or so different phenomena that we only have one word for in English. Religion can mean roughly the same thing as "culture" - the beliefs that parents teach their children and have an expectation, reasonable or not, that the kids will carry that culture on and pass it on to their kids. On the other hand, religion can mean doctrines and beliefs that the individual has to think, believe, or "have faith in" - and by definition, that's individual rather than cultural. On yet another hand, religion can mean personal relationship with Deity, with Higher Consciousness - which can be (and in my opinion usually is) separate from either of the other two. Then there's community and group work motivated by altruism, which only rarely overlaps any of the other three. Yet we only have one word for all these separate phenomena: they're "religion." The same people who decry the work of Christian missionaries on Indian reservations ("Cultural imperialism! It'll be the death of that whole way of life!") defend heartily their right to practice a way of life, to maintain beliefs, to identify with a religious culture and to relate to Deity in a way entirely opposed to the way their parents brought THEM up. Perhaps this doesn't seem odd to you, but it certainly seems odd to me. --- Sirius 0.50 * Origin: WeirdBase * St. Louis * 1-314-389-WYRD * (Opus 1:100/523) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (371) Sun 13 Mar 88 13:13 By: Larry Hudson To: Brad Hicks Re: Neo-Paganism St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:9b58 106d69ba This is a response to a response you gave to Curly Howard way back in Aug of 85 (File called Ritual.Txt Okay-here's where I am: Always, since I can remember ( in this life) I have been Pagan.(Other lives, too, but I won't go into these) I grew up in a very strict, small, Mormon town (to where myu family, at times, was the only "Heathen" family around) There was no Pagan structure to our lives - no religious structure at all j- since growing up, my sisters have chosen their own paths. I have always isolated myself from others, gone walking in the hills, and feel the Gods&Goddesses there with a fierceness that was sometimes frightening. If I let it happen, the "old energy" starts to rise within me. My trouble is: when this energy does rise, I don't have any release for it. I can't control it, and if I let it enter my physical body, I often get ill because of my lack of training. I get restless, I can't sleep, and I feel a tightness in my spine. About 8 yrs ago, my husband and I moved to California to persue the American Dream. While there, I encountered yoga & threw myself into it with much ferver & devotion. My teacher was (or seemed) very uptight and narrow. He would scorn avenues that were interesting to me )Tantra of which I know very little; Magick of which he refused even to speak; and other paths that seemed quite natural as my next step). The yoga group had a falling out, the teacher quit, and I was left with carrots dangling in front of me in all directions and no idea what to do. The "energy" was once again shut down and life took on the plastic on-dimension of "dry" times before. jRecently, I have moved back to that small town in which I grew with the moon, and the seasons. I came across the book "Drawing Down the Moon", read it with tears in my eyes and now the energy is back - with a vengence! I believe there will come a time (perhaps has already come) when I will no longer be able to "shut it down." jThere is definitely something pushing it's way through my psyche and I don't know what to do! It's making me bonkers - strung tight like a guitar string. Things are happening. I got other books. Scott Cunningham's Natural Magic series. Ed Fitch's Rituals from the Crystal Well. And the heavy-duty 80 lb. killer, the Golden Dawn. There are so many things that I know that I know, but I don't remember how to remember them! One morning I awoke and knew that I should go to this little second-hand store to get "my" mirror. I just KNEW. So I walked in the door and this huge 3 ft round mirror sits and grins right in fromt of me. So I buy it of course and lug it home. Now what do I DO with it? I feel like an amnesiac among people I love. I know I love them - I just don't remember WHY! I guess what I want from you is no advice, really but acknowledgement. Am I bonkers? Does my story match up with any others you have heard? Does anybody else out there want to comment? I am virtually alone in this, or so it seems. I've read and read everything I can get my hands on. I've read authors who say "Do this, and while you do this, say this..." Other authors who say "Neo-Pagans do this; they believe this; they are this..." Basically I feel this to be just more carrot-dangling . I WANT what you described in your response to Curly, but nobody will tell me HOW to get it. This town i'm in is a million light years from anywhere, and it doesn't look as though we will be leaving anytime in the near future. I've heard people say ther are Neo-Pagans who work alone. How? --- * Origin: House Atriedes-(818) 965-7220 HST-JungleLaser (Opus 1:103/602) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (372) Sat 19 Mar 88 8:22 By: Josh Gordon To: Draco ... Re: Re: Crowley St: Pvt --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:954a 107342c8 D.>One other question which I haven't even begun to try to understand D.>yet is the relation between Nuit and Hadit. Think you can explain D.>what they represent? Why do they figure so prominenty in the D.>Book of the Law? I think of Nuit and Hadit and Ra-Hoor-Khuit (or -Khut?) as something of a triple-god manifestation of the nature of godhead. Nuit is she who is adored; she is the power of beauty, and sensuality, and natural attractiveness, and omnipresent splendor. Hadit, on the other hand, is the inverse, the adorer, the act of worship itself; it is Hadit who worships Nuit (and, by extension, All). RHK is more difficult to fit into this paradigm, but I'm owrking on it. Perhaps the crowned and conquering child is the Magical Child of Nuit and Hadit, the precipitate that develops when the Worshipped and the Worshipper become as one. It is easy (and common) to meditate on the nature of Nuit. Shakti is a relatively simple Yoga; to devote oneself to God or Goddess by adoration is an ancient, noble, and well known path to ones Holy Guardian Angel (to use the deliberately ridiculous word). It is more difficult, but equally beneficial, to do the reverse: devote oneself to Hadit, the worshipper; to become the object of adoration and of meditation. To do so, one has to accept one's godhood; in the absence of such acceptance, to be worshipped is to risk madness (or at least cognitive dissonance). It would have been very easy (and perhaps more sensible, if this were an authored book!) for AC to have written in terms of, say, Geb and Nuit. I would think the imagery of Geb, lying on his back with his phallus rising to the sky, almost touching the lithe, arched body of Nuit, would have been very attractive to Crowley. It is well worth considering just why Nuit and Hadit are there, and Geb is absent. What is the message in the breaking of ancient convention? Ra-Hoor-Khuit needs more consideration, as well. This complex, combined God is the result of the eclipsing of the pure Ra worshippers; he is a combination of Ra and Hoor-Khuit. (At the time RHK was worshipped, Ra worship had virtually disappeared, and showed up only as one of many combined forms). I understand RHK the least, and perhaps he deserves the most study. Perhaps he is the actual chemical process in the Alchymical Marriage of Nuit and Hadit, rather than the result; perhaps the actual _result_ is you, the reader, the student. Consider "The Lovers" as the glyph of the marriage. Then is "Art" maybe the glyph of the consummation of the marriage; then perhaps "The Tower" might be the nature of RHK as the reaction itself; then perhaps, what, "the Universe" is the result? It's so nice to be a Center of Pestilence. Glad I could help. --- * Origin: ThelemaNet - Hail Eris! * (415) 548-0163 (Opus 1:161/93) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (373) Sat 19 Mar 88 8:21 By: Morgana Silverthorn To: Larry Hudson Re: Re: Neo-Paganism St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:e7cb 107342b3 Dear Larry, please excuse me for butting in. I am Morgana Silverthorn, Neo-Pagan, Witch and occasional teacher. While reading through the messages I notice that you had not received any replies (I'm sure will receive many) yet I thought I would try to help. There are many who work alone, some who have always worked alone and some who now work alone from choice. I have little insight to offer you about "how to" because each person's "how to" is slightly different. There is no one single absolute truth unless it is that there is no one single absolute truth. As difficult as it may be, the only and best advice I can offer is keep searching. Read, anything that sounds interesting, try. And not just once or twice. If it really sounds interesting, it may not be easy to do. I am still trying to learn "how to's" that I know I "should" be able to do but can't seem to get the hang of. Listen to people, go to lectures, classes etc. Hypnosis, NLP, Herbcraft, etc. Wander though bookstores and read/thumb through interesting books. Keep yourself open to the possibilities - it will come through eventually. gotta run - outta time - Morgana --- * Origin: TIDMADT: Ex Skilletus Ad WOCum! (703) 370-7054 (Opus 1:109/728) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (374) Sun 20 Mar 88 12:05 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: Aries St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 60ae1074 Slate grey, cold Aries Bites the Air with solemn grace In this Nothern place Of harsh Earth-wisdom Of hardy old souls Of new souls reaching for life The ots are twisting Little, waiting shivering buds Waiting for bursting Ecstacy coming Hard on in the Sun Bustling, quivering buds Hard with slick pleasure That will grow beyond measure And burst with great sighs Between the strong thighs Of men and women Grappling for Springtime's passions (Well, young ones fuck Old ones dream Sipping the cream Out of memories muck!) --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (375) Sun 20 Mar 88 21:25 By: Rowan Moonstone To: All Re: We Are one..... St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:99b8 ab321074 Wrote some new verses to the song Cybele taught us in Dallas, and I wanted to share them with all of you. The original goes We are one with the infinite sun Forever and ever and ever ( x 2) And the wheel of the year goes round and round And the circle of the wheel goes round( x 2) We've added the following verses: We are one with the horses that run We fly high with the eagles in the sky We swim free with the fishes in the sea.... The dark moist Earth is the womb of our birth.... The ripples expand from the tough of Her hand..... The wolf children cry to the moon in the sky..( for Blackwolf) We've also changed the chorus slightly to go "And the wheel of the year goes round and round and the circle of the wheel goes round And the wheel of the year goes round and round And the SPIRIT of the wheel goes round." The ending we're currently singing uses the tune for the verse and the following words, growing softer as they end "And my spirit soars with the turning of the wheel forever and ever and ever....." --- ConfMail V3.3 * Origin: On The Edge BBS - Only source for MAGICKNET in OKC. (1:147/4) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (376) Sat 26 Mar 88 7:53 By: Geoff Gilpin To: All Re: Christmas St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:513d 107a3ea6 Outside: "Hark the Herald Angels sing, Glory to the newborn king..." Then, inside: "Azael, Baphomet, Chemosh, you many-headed star, you blinder of fools..." "Peace on Earth and mercy mild..." "Lean down and whisper your names, sit at my table and taste of my spirit..." "God and sinners reconciled..." "Lousy brats!" The man in robes, his concentration broken, came down through the spheres and pulled the curtain in time to see the last caroller wandering out of the porch light. "Lousy brats," he said again as the odor of Chemosh departed. It's tough to be an occultist in a working class neighborhood. --- * Origin: Fox Valley Technical College, Appleton, WI (414) 735-2513 (Opus 1:139 /640) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (377) Mon 28 Mar 88 12:47 By: Josh Gordon To: All Re: Newspaper story on Cult Awareness Week St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:954a 107c65ed San Francisco Chronicle Monday, March 28, 1988 "Jonestown Resolution Ignites Debate" by Larry Liebert Chronicle Washington Bureau Chief Washington--Commemorating the madness of the mass suicides at Jonestown a decade ago would hardly seem controversial in a capital where resolutions are passed by the truckload. But the approaching 10th anniversary of the carnage that took the lives of 913 people, mostly from the Bay Area, has revived a bitter debate over the threat from cults and the threat to religious freedom posed by anticult crusaders. The seemingly innocuous resolution that has caused conflict in the halls of Congress would designate a "Cult Awareness Week" this November to mark the 10th anniversary of the murders and mass suicides at the Rev. Jim Jones' cult retreat in Guyana. The House resolution was introduced by Representative Tom Lantos, D-San Mateo. His predecessor from the Peninsula, Leo Ryan, was slain as he led a group to investigate Jones' Guyana retreat. "We're approaching the 10th anniversary of one of the most ghoulish and nightmarish tragedies of recent years," said Lantos. "I think it would have been a dereliction of duty on my part not to remind the nation." But the fine print in Lantos' resolution has revived a debate about cults and religious freedom. The resolution asserts that there are more than 2,500 cults in the United States, with 1 million to 3 million members subjected to "mind-control techniques" ranging from "isolation from friends and family" to "promotion of total dependency on the group and fear of leaving it." Such blanket assertions have angered a coalition of critics ranging from the American Civil Liberties Union to the Zen master from Malibu who calls himself Rama. They charge that the resolution will encourage the coercive practices of "deprogrammers", who have been known to seize suspected cult members and pressure them into renouncing their beliefs. The critics trace the resolution to a group of anticult crusaders known as the Cult Awareness Network. "For them to be asking the Congress to denounce 2,500 religious groups as cults and to make the kind of broad accusations that resolution makes is clearly an unconstitutional act," said Barry Lynn, legislative counsel to the American Civil Liberties Union. "Congress is not in the theology business." Representatives of the Cult Awareness Network did not return repeated phone calls. Lantos acknowledged that his staff had worked on the anti-cult resolution with Ryan's daughter, Patricia, who is associated with the group. Now that Lantos' resolution is attracting controversy, the congressman hinted that he may let it drop without even bringing it to a House vote. He argued that the resolution has "already achieved its purpose" by calling attention to the anniversary of the massacre. If so, it has also underlined the difficulty of judging when a religious leader becomes a charlatan and when religious followers surrender their individuality to a cult. The most outspoken foe of Lantos' resolution has been Frederick Lenz, a 38-year-old former English professor who lives in Malibu and calls himself Zen Master Rama. The ordinarily reclusive religious leader has been here lobbying for the defeat of the resolution--and to defend himself against charges that he is just the sort of cult leader parents should warn their children about. "Jim Jones was clearly a hustler, charlatan, and madman," said Lenz. "But that's no excuse to push your own moral and political viewpoint to interfere with First Amendment rights and engage in illegal activities. To make his case, Lenz brought along Jennifer Jacobs, a follower who says she was kidnapped in an unsuccessful deprogramming attempt. "They terrified my parents so much that they were willing to put down $25,000 on the spot to have me kidnaped and psychologically abused," said Jacobs. "I was held for 11 days in a seedy motel room in Seattle, completely against my will." ... --- * Origin: ThelemaNet - Hail Eris! * (415) 548-0163 (Opus 1:161/93) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (378) Thu 31 Mar 88 20:12 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: Hunger St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 a199107f Well, Spring in Minnesota has a coldness like mid-Western concrete or railroad tracks that run through the center of Minneapolis or the Mississippi River with ice that is breaking up. Spring in Minnesota is hard, the air is hard...Spring slips back into Winter for two days and then it rains and is bitter cold. To my right is an Etrscan Sword, one of a kind, I am told. It leans against the East wall of my bedroom, the hilt crowned by a sunburst with 24 rays resting on the bottom of a metallic print of an owl that I bought from a sensitive, hungry asian on Lyndale Ave. last Fall. I also bought a metallic print of Pegasus from him. Over the owl print is a page from the Larousse Dictionary of Mythology with a photo of a statue of Minerva, a coin like thing with Minerva on it and another coinlike thing with a figure of Mercury on it. Above that is a very tasty color print photo of a statue of Minerva that I saw years ago in Bill Heidrick's pschedelic house in Marin County and loved but was not able to find a copy of the book until recently. He would not let me tear the page out of the book at that time...naturally. The powerful release of energy in the Spring is torrential here in the upper Midwest. There is something brutal about what happens when Winter is overr. Winter is brutal enough but when it is finished it really gets strange. Over the past week or so I have listened to the Llewellan (wierd, Welsh word that I could never quite master) tapes by Denning and Phillips and they have damn near taken over my life. I got them at Evenstar, a local Pagan bookstore I love quite dearly inspite of the fact that I have not been able to attract their attention. Oh, yes...I have indeed attracted their attention, but I am still looking for a receptive, sane, intelligent and wonderful wicca circle and have been in such a quiet, inarticulate rage at the store and the owners that I had not visited Evenstar for about a year. Well, I walked in, said a few words to the somber, exqusitely attractive witch who was running the shop. I had not met her. Poked around. Found eight or nine of these tapes. Bought them for sixty bucks and went home talking to myself about spells to sell and things like that. Paranoia is part of my psyche. (times up!) --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (379) Sat 2 Apr 88 6:59 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: Continued St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 37611082 The paranoid streak in my nature seems to be gentled by these tapes which are supplying the soul food I have hungered for for months. I reccomend them to one and all with great enthusiasm. They are showing me something about the Tree of Life. One can put anything anywhere on the Tree and it will work. The Tree is a very flexible geometry. THAT is the key to the Tree. It is the geometrical form that is the important thing. Whatever one imposes on the Tree is irrelevant or like frosting on a cake. The four joined circles, each touching the center of another, on a line are the important thing. The points of intersection chosen by whoever it was who first designed the Tree are equally important...and of course the lines drawn to indicate the paths are important. Giving names to the Sephiroth, placing Intelligences on the Paths, Hebrew letters...and then ultimately "pathworkings," or initiatory, guided imagery trips...all of this is irrelevant to the purpose of the Tree of Life. The purpose of all of the added stuff is to fix ever more clearly and ever more deeply the shape of the Tree which I suspect is some kind of astral design...astral vehicle that will be deeply etched in very deep levels of consciousness of those drawn to this work...whose genuine purpose will be realized at death. I think it may be a kind of Noah's Ark that is available even now for voyages through time, space, inner space and timeless space. The path working is helping me see tsomething of the uses this dynamic geometry has. As one begins to see the differant pathworkings that others have applied, each more or less idiosycratic, one begins to see that anything goes...best it has an inner consistancy...but any logical story ccan be applied to these paths. The important thing is that the paths are learned. I learned them in the early 70's under the canny guidance of Frater Albertus in Utah. Though I had worked with them myself before that time, the word to ear teaching went deep within me. Recently, with a gentleman named Bruce LaHue, I enjoyed a quicky course in the paths that was both powerful and wierdly idiosyncratic based mostly on Shining Paths and partly on Mr. LaHue rather gaudy and livid imagination. Though I paid him his forty bucks for eight sessions (as many as three paths a session, God help us all!), I feel a gratitude for his contribution to my spiritual growth. Inspite of his obsession with gory, exploitation horror films, he communicated a deep understanding of the Tree...which just goes to show you. Inspite of the fact that the course was given in a yuppified supermarket for occult trivia, there was an initiation of sorts given and recieved, at least by me. Genuine occult growth takes place in strange places under even stranger circumstances. At the moment on this cold, grey spring day...the Saturday between Good Friday (a special day indeed -- eggs, Frater Albertus was wont to say, that are laid on Good Friday never spoil -- a fact that eager alchemy students who lived on farms demonstrated time and again)...I am going to the local Science Fiction Conferance -- Minicon. Yesterday, on Good Friday, instead of finding a freshly laid egg, I went to the Minneapolis Institute of Art and purchased a magnificent figure of Anubis which seems appropriate to the Good Friday, Black Saturday, Easter sequence. I will take him in spirit to Minicom, which may well have something to do with Hell where Jesus spent some time on this day. --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (380) Mon 4 Apr 88 10:02 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: A Buddhist (maybe) Statement that is beautiful: St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 50441084 THIS IS THE GREATEST BLESSING NOT TO SERVE THE FOOLISH BUT TO SERVE THE WISE TO HONOR THOSE WORTHY OF HONOR}i TO DWELL IN A PLEASANT LAND WITH RIGHT DESIRES IN THE HEART TO MAINTAIN SELF CONTROL AND BE PLEASANT OF SPEEK THAT EVERY WORD MAY BE WELL SPOKEN TO LIVE RIGHTEOUSLY TO GIVE HELP TO KINDRED TO FOLLOW A PEACEFUL CALLING TO ABHOR AND CEASE FROM EVIL-DOING NOT TO BE WEAR IN WELL DOING TO BE LONG-SUFFERING AND MEEK, TO ASSOCIATE WITH PEACEABLE Beneath the stroke of life's changes The mind that shaketh not Without grief or passion That is secure: ON EVERY SIDE THEY ARE INVINCIBLE WHO DO ACTS LIKE THESE ON EVERY SIDE THEY WALK IN SAFETY AND THEIRS IS THE GREATEST BLESSING attributed to Gautama Buddha (Fifth Century B.C.) --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (381) Mon 4 Apr 88 10:44 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Members Re: Pagan Christs St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 10845590 The Sacrifical God man How did the Christian mythos arise? Where did it come from? The Christian myth is almost totally Pagan in origin. I used to think that anything outside the Judeo/Christian/Moslem Belief System or worldview was Pagan. Such is not the case. The two main features of the CBS are the Eucharist and Sacrifice of a God man. These two features were well known and well loved by Pagan mystery cults centuries before the Christian Cults intergrated them into the Gospels. The Eucharist goes way back into history and is based upon the ritual consumption of the God man. Osiris, Dionysus, Attis and many others were ritually consumed. The practice dates back to prehistory when a human sacrifice was identified with the God (perhaps a Vegetative God) and was sacrificed and eaten. Over the ages human sacrifice was found detestable. Animals were then substituted and sacrificed as the ritual identifier of the God which was then followed by grain offerings, breads shaped into the form of the God, sometimes in the shapes of natural items (sun, moon, etc.). The mythos of the Jewish Christ integrated this practice into it's mysteries. There is strong reason for this. For some 200 plus years before the time recorded for Jesus the Greeks and their mystery cults invaded and changed Israel for all time. A war was instituted to diminish or wipeout the Hellenizing influence. Part of the Hellenizing influence was an effort to update or change the Jewish religion to something more applicable to the times. After the Maccabbes War the Hellenizing cultist were driven underground; right to the heart of the Jewish mystical culture. Hence the Greek influence upon the myth of Jesus. The sacrifice of the God man (Jesus, Attis, Adonis, Osiris) was a well known and well loved feature also. In fact it was necessary to have a willing sacrifice before a Eucharist could be performed. When the sacrifice was not willing the legs and sometimes arms of the sacrifice were broken to make it look like the sacrifice was willing (not struggling against the sacrificers). Jesus was a willing sacrifice. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (382) Mon 4 Apr 88 10:45 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Members Re: Pagan Christs, part ii St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 108455ad Images of Attis (Tammuz/Dummuzi) were nailed or impaled upon a pine tree. The Jews knew this and wrote "Cursed is he who hangs upon a tree." A goat was substituted for a boy in sacrifice to Dionysus at Potniae and a hart for a virgin at Laodicea. King Athamas had been called upon to sacrifice his first born son by the Delphic Oracle, Melenloas sacrificed two children in Egypt when stayed by contrary winds; three Persian boys were offered up at the battle of Salamis. It was only in the time of Hadrian that the annual human sacrifice to Zeus was abolished at Salamis in Cyprus. The God man Jesus was hung upon a tree; he was also the lamb of God. As such the sacrifice and Eucharist of the God man Jesus is purely Pagan in origin. Part of the older Pagan sacrifices was in the King sacrificing his only begotten son. Jesus was the only begotten son of the King of Israel, sacrificed to take away the sins of the world. This practice was overturned in the myth of Abraham and Issac when it was found detestable and injurious to the tribe or kingdom. Yet the God man Jesus was sacrificed in the flesh. This was done to appeal to the underground Greek mystery cults who had much in common with the Jewish Christian Cultist. "During centuries of this evolution, the Jewish people tasted many times the bitterness of despair and the profound doubt denounced by the last of the prophets. In periods when many went openly over to Hellenism, it could not be but the the ancient rites of the Semitic race were revived, as some are declared to have been in earlier times of trouble. Among the rites of expiation and propititiation, none stood traditionally higher than the sacrifice of the king, or the king's son. The Jews saw such an act performed for them, as it were, when the Romans under Anthony, at Herod's wish, scourged, crucified [lit. bound to stake], and beheaded Antigonous, the last of the Asmonean priest kings in 37 B.C." _Pagan_Christs_ page 44,45 by J. M. Robertson The mode of sacrifice was predetermined by previous Pagan doctrine. The type of sacrifice was also predetermined by Pagan doctrine. Both the sacrifice of the king, and the king's son were incorporated into the Gospel myth. The God man Jesus is both the King of the Jews and the son of God, the king of Israel. As stated before the sacrifice of the king or king's son was found injurious to the state. Before animal and grain sacrifices, criminals and prisoners of war were substituted. Yet the criminal had to be identified with the king. This was done by putting royal robes on the sacrifice and parading the sacrifice around, calling it the king. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (383) Mon 4 Apr 88 10:46 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Members Re: Pagan Christs, part iii St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 108455ce "The number three was of mystic significance in many parts of the East. The Dravidians of India sacrificed three victims to the Sun-god. In western as in eastern Asia, the number three would have its votaries in respect of trinitartian concepts as well as the primary notions of 'the heavens, the earth, and the underworld.' Traditionally, the Syrian rite called for a royal victim. The substitution of a criminal for the king or kings son was repugnet, however, to the higher doctrine that the victim be unblemished. To solve this problem one of the malefactors was distinguished from the other criminals by a ritual of mock-crowning and robing in the spirit of 'sympathetic magic'. By parading him as king, and calling the others what indeed they were, it was possible to attain the semblence of a truly august sacrifice." _Pagan_Christs_, by J.M. Robertson page 45 There is nothing in this mythos that did not originate in other cultures. "We can only conclude that the death ritual of the Christian creed was framed in a pagan environment and embodies some of the most widespread ideas of Pagan religion. the two aspects in which the historic Christ is typically presented to his worshipers, those of his infancy and death, are typically Pagan." _Pagan_Christs_ by J.M Roberts, page 52. What about the man Jesus then? Was he divine? Did he exist? Is/was he the Savior? Most, if not all, of the Christian Belief System is Pagan in origin. It is indeed hard to force oneself to believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Messiah, the Son of God when such titles were readily copied from Pagan doctrine. Perhaps the only item not borrowed from Pagan sources was the Messiah concept. That, of course, was taken from the Jewish hysteria of the time. In the siege of Jerusalem in 72 C.E. there were some 18 Messiahs inside Jerusalem alone. Neither the God man Jesus nor the self proclaimed militant messiahs saved Jerusalem. Such was the measure of hysterical superstition upon the nation of Israel. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (384) Mon 4 Apr 88 10:47 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Members Re: Pagan Christs, part iv St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 108455f7 "There is not a conception associated with Christ that is not common to some or all of the Savior cults of antiquity. The title Savior was given in Judaism to Yahweh; among the Greeks to Zeus, Heilos, Artemis, Dionysus, Hercales, the Dioscurui, Ceybele and Aesculapius. It is the essential conception of Osiris. So, too, Osiris taketh away sin, is the judge of the dead and of the last judgment. Dionysus, the Lord of the UnderWorld and primarily a god of feasting ('the Son of Man commeth eating and drinking'), comes to be conceived as the Soul of the World and the inspirer of chastity and self purification. [J. M. Robertson may be referring to Attis here.] From the Mysteries of Dionysus and Isis comes the proclamation of the easy 'yoke'. Christ not only works the Dionysiac miracle, but calls himself the 'true vine.'" "Like Christ, and like Adonis and Attis, Osiris and Dionysus also suffer and die and rise again. To become one with them is the mystical passion of their worshippers. They are all alike in that their mysteries give immortality. From Mithraism Christ takes the symbolic keys of heaven and hell and assumes the function of the virgin-born Saoshyant, the destroyer of the Evil One. Like Mithra, Merodach, and the Egyptian Khousu, he is the Mediator; like Khousu, Horus and Merodach, he is one of a trinity, like Horus he is grouped with a Divine Mother; like Khousu he is joined to the Logos; and like Merodach he is associated with the Holy Spirit, one of whose symbols is fire." "In fundamentals, therefore, Christism is but paganism reshaped. It is only the economic and doctrinal evolution of the system--the first determined by Jewish practice and Roman environment, the second by Greek thought--that constitutes new phenomena in religious history." _Pagan_ _Christs_ by J.M. Robertson pages 52,53 No religion develops in a vacuum. All religions are influenced not only by it's predecessors but by the contemporaries of the time also. Such is the nature of Christism yesterday and today. Now about Jesus the man, did he exist? I think not. All the teaching of Jesus can be attributed to other sources and grafted over the Gospel myth. Nothing he said was substantially different in any way from previous sayings. Jesus was not a man but a contrived myth. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (385) Mon 4 Apr 88 10:48 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Members Re: Pagan Christs, part v St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 1084561a "The Christian myth grew by absorbing details from pagan cults. The birth story is similar to many nativity myths in the pagan world. The Christ had to have a Virgin for a mother. Like the image of the child-god in the cult of Dionysus, he was pictured in swaddling clothes in a basket manger. He was born in a stable like Horus--the stable temple of the Virgin Goddess, Isis, Queen of Heaven. Again , like Dionysus, he turned water into wine, like Aesculapius, he raised men from the dead and gave sight to the blind; and like Attis and Adonis, he is mourned and rejoiced over by women. His resurrection took place, like that of Mithra, from a rock tomb." The man Jesus did not exist. There are however sources that speak of others seeing him. These were secondhand sources. No direct observations were made. At one time or another we have all had a vision of Deity in our minds. Such is the sight of Jesus, a mental image. What of the Gospels then? They are passion plays designed to be read or acted out in front of an audience. Passion plays were a common feature of pagan religion. Looking at the Gospels themselves one finds a chopply written, scene by scene, display of the life of the God man. Only the important aspects of his life are described. The minor events and influences of the life of Jesus are not recorded, which leaves one to think that the Gospels are indeed a play. "When we turn from the reputed teaching of Jesus to the story of his career, the presumption is that it has a factual basis is so slender as to be negligible. The Church found it so difficult to settle the date of its alleged founder's birth that the Christian era was made to begin some years before the year which chronologists latter inferred on the strength of other documents. The nativity was placed at the winter solstice, thus coinciding with the birthday of the Sun-god. And the date for the crucifiction was made to vary from year to year to conform to the astronomical principle which fixed the Jewish Passover. [The Passover is moon based, an already familiar pagan method of cyclic, monthly dating.] In between the birth and death of Jesus, there is an almost total absence of information except about the brief period of his ministry. Of his life between the ages of twelve and thirty we know nothing. There are not even any myths. It is impossible to establish with any accuracy the duration of the ministry from the Gospels. According to the tradition it lasted one year, which suggests that it was either based on the formula 'the acceptable year of the Lord', or on the myth of the Sun-god." _Pagan_Christs_ by J.M. Robertson, page 68 --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (386) Wed 6 Apr 88 15:47 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Re: Historical Jesus? St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 10867df6 The Quest for the Historical Jesus "...It is only in comparitively modern times that the possibility was considered that Jesus does not belong to history at all. Those who come across this idea for the first time are naturally startled by it. In fact the suspicion that Jesus might be as mythical as other ancient saviors as Osiris, Mithra and Krishna arose as a result of a serious effort to discover his real voice and actions. the most scrupulous of analysis of the texts failed to reveal a convincing picture of an authentic person." _Pagan_Christs_, page 63 Well such is what J.M. Robertson claims. "Modern biblical critics freely admit that some of the Gospel narritive must be fiction. We know now that much of it was composed well after the events it purports to describe. Comparitive religion has drawn attention to close pagan parallels--to the essential features of the story--the virgin birth, the sacrifical death and resurrection. The same is true of the rites of baptism and sacramental communion. Many critics still feel, however, that these are accretions which, together with, togehter with the miracles, can be safely shed without injury to a nucleus if historical fact. The argue that pagan Gods may have some of the attributes of Jesus, and although they may have been regarded as law givers and teachers, they did not leave behind a coherent and profound teaching. Apollo, Osiris and the rest seem, therefore, to be obviously mythical, whereas Buddha and Jesus are not. The teachings of each of the latter, it is felt, bear the unmistakable of a single, unique mind. Such a doctrine could not have formed itself spontaneously." _Pagan_Christs_, page 64. The rite of baptism has already been discussed in this topic. Robertson contends that the rite of baptism superceeded the rite of circumsicion. This makes sense to me. It is much less painful and physically safer to undergo ritual initiation through baptism by water than by ritual circumcision. The gentile Christists would contend for this; and as the Jewish Christists died baptism did replace circumcision as a physical sign of new spiritual being. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (387) Wed 6 Apr 88 15:49 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Re: Historical Jesus, part ii St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 10867e2b "We shall consider the case of Buddha later. First let us look at the main objections to this view that the existence of a body of teaching is overwhelming evidence of the existence of an historical teacher. The earliest Christian documents are ascribed to Paul. These epistles were written long before the canonical gospels were put together and accepted by the Church. The older protions, however, tell us nothing about the life of Jesus. The silence of paul is remarkable if indeed he was familiar with the Jesuine biography. Secondly, the unity of teaching, which it is said, would show it to have been the work of one mind is conspicuously absent. So far from displaying coherence, the ethical precepts are frequently obscure and contradictory. So far from being original, many of the sayings are merely quotations from Hebrew literature, and some have pagan parallels. As for the Sermon on the Mount, it is no more than a patchwork of utterances found in the Old Testament." _Pagan_Christs_ pg. 64 I was suprised to hear that some of the Epistles of Paul are the earliest of the Christian writings. Anyone care to point us to an already typed in dating of the N.T.? Care to type one in? If such is the case then it is outstanding that as Paul was the first to write about mystery of the sacrifice of Christ he tells us nothing of the life of Christ. It's as if he didn't know. Surely he would have known such details being close to the original twelve. Perhaps he didn't care, such details being meaningless as the ethics, mystery and sacrifice of the God man were most important. It seems the earliest of the gospel forms was lost with Matthew and Mark being dependent opon these lost forms. This scans nicely. The earliest forms were probably the purest of the Jewish Christian story of the Messiah. As time went by more of the pagan gentile influence was felt as needed. Various features of the virgin birth of the God man, the nativity scenes, the Last Supper, the betrayal, the crucifiction and mysterious ressurection were incoroprated into the present gospels to appeal to pagan cultist. Some scholars indicate that Revelations was next inline. This scans nicely as it presents a supposedly Jewish-Christian eschotology. When one looks at the symbolism one can see the Mazedian influence in Revelations. Revelations seems to present a first or second step in the evolution of the Sacrifice and Resurrection of the God man. Perhaps a middle step is more appropriate. A middle step between Jewish Messiah cults and Gentile Savour cults. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (388) Wed 6 Apr 88 15:51 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Re: Historical Jesus, part iii St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 10867e68 It would be monumental to eliminate all supposedly contradictory and questionable passages from the Gospels. Fortunately that work has already been done with some suprising, for me at least, outcomes. Here's one.. "For over a hundred years German scholars have been struggling to solve this problem, and their efforts have been unavailing. In order to establish some solid textual foundation for the historicity of Jesus, they have piled hypothesis upon hypothesis with ever new refinements. The retreat from this hopless task was finally sounded by the emminent German critic, O. Schmeidel. Afer an exhuastive search, he was satisfied that he had discovered some texts which passes the most severe tests and were entirely credible. But in the whole of the gospels all he could salvage were NINE such texts. Let us enumerate this forlorn handful of unwounded survivors. 1) Mark XXX.17 [really mark 10.17] f.f. "Why callest me thou good?" etc. 2) Matt XII.31 f.f. "Blasphemy against the Son of Man pardonable" 3) Mark III.21 "He is beside himself" 4) Mark XII.32 "Of that hour and day knoweth no man" 5) Mark XV.34, Matt "My God, My God, why hast thou forsaken me?" etc. 6) Mark VIII.12 "No sign shall be given this generation." 7) Mark VI.5 "He was able to do no mighty work there." 8) Mark VIII.14-21 Rebuke to disciples concerning bread and leaven.." 9) Matt XI.5, Luke VII.22 Passage to be taken in the sense of spiritual healing, since it ends with mention of preaching--not a miracle at all." _Pagan_Christs_ pgs 64,65. What was the basis for selecting these texts? Basicly O. Sshmeiedel felt that where Jesus speaks simply as a man, making no pretense to divinity, or to miraculous powers, and where he is presented as failing to impress his relatives and neighbors with any sense of his superiority--there the record is entirely credible. I'll have to quote this because of the logical content... J.M. Roberts quoting Schmeidel: "According to Schmidel, these passages represent "the foundation pillars for a truly scientific life of Jesus... They prove not only that in the person of Jesus we have to do with a completely human being, and that the divine is sought in him only in the form in which it is capable of being found in a man; THEY ALSO PROVE THAT HE REALLY DID EXIST, and that the Gospels contain at least SOME ABSOLUTELY TURSTWORTHY FACTS concerning him. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (389) Wed 6 Apr 88 15:53 By: Ammond Shadowcraft To: All Re: Historical Jesus, part iv St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ca31 10867eb4 This will shock the believer without satisfying the scientific naturalist. I submit that the propostition I have italicized is absolutely untenable. On this point may be staked the whole dispute about the actuality of the gospel Jesus. It simply does not follow that because a statement is credible it is therefore trustworth or proved. If it were so, half the characters in fiction could be "proved" to be real people. Perfectly credible statements are made about them." _Pagan_Christs_ pgs 64-65. And I would add that perfectly credible statements are made by fictional characters also. It is credible to pronounce that Joe Catholic said a hundred Hail Marys this morning. Such is a credible statement concerning Catholics. But is it trustworthy? Such thinking requires a leap. The leap involves a thought process that says what is possible must indeed be true. T.X. Huxley makes this same mistake. Huxley says that Sauls visit with the Witch of Endor is entirely probable, so there is no reason not to believe it. It is probable that I, as a child, fell into a dark hole for 3 days and nights. History is full of discredited "probablilites". To finish this section up I'd like to say that what applies to characters of fiction must also apply to demigods and characters about whom there is a fable. Unless it can be shown on independent grounds how the credible story came to be associated with the fable, we have no reason to accept one and reject the other. There are instances of myths being built up on a basis of facutal events, but although this can be established in modern times, such cases do not enable us to distinguish between the merely possible and the actual in ancient tradition. Admittedly there are borderline cases, but even when these are free from supernaturalism they may often be doubted. --- * Origin: SMARTNet - Changing for the better (I hope!) (Opus 1:128/23) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (390) Sat 9 Apr 88 7:35 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: Poems St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 3c7b1089 (I found these poems from another time while prowling through Chaos!) THE RAINBOW PROMISE With quantum leap the light of love illumines every heart Humans of the world unite in the light of love Let the light of unity flash love from heart to heart And blow away the mushroom cloud in waves of living love Lovers of the world unite in the light of love Christian, Buddhist, Hindu, Moslem, Jew: all you others too Let the light of unity flash love from heart to heart And blow away that angry cloud in waves of living love Let love explode in vaults of banks, in the hearts of thieves In generals hearts, in lawyers hearts. In our hears Let the light of unity flash love from heart to heart And blow away that bitter cloud in waves of living love In prisons and in hospitals let human love flow free All races in a rainbow, one great loving symphony Let the light of unity flash love from heart to heart And blow away that hatefilled crowd in waves of living love Let our one great rainbow song of love flow up Our rich and holy promise to the Living God on High To let the light of unity flash love from heart to heart And blow away the mushroom cloud in waves of living love copywright by Hugh Read 1983 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (391) Sat 9 Apr 88 7:47 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: Yet another poem out of Chaos St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 3de91089 THE BALLAD OF ALLIGATOR FLATS ...dedicated to Michael... Old Mose he cried He sputtered and died His gas tank dried And there we sat In the desert flats Singing songs to Jesus Visions danced before our eyes Silent vultures in the skies Sang silent songs of one who dies Where we sat In the desert flats Singing songs to Jesus Old Mike, he sat, grinning wide Looked to God and Fate defied His songs decreed the Devil lied And there we sat In the Desert flats Singing songs to Jesus That devil, fear, stung my heart Our gas tank dry as a desert fart My soul has shrunk to a gristly wart As there we sat In the desert flats Singing songs to Jesus Old Mike, he sung, Water to wine, water to wine Water to gas would be just fine So we pissed in the tank, first his then mine And there we sat In the desert flats Singing songs to Jesus Old Mose he coughed and gripped the tar Shuddered and sighed ready for war And lightning flashed on the mountain far As there we sat On the desert flats Singing songs to Jesus He bucked and reared I shuddered and feared By God he started and we put him in gear No more we sat On the desert flats As we sang our songs to Jesus --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (392) Thu 5 May 88 7:50 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: The Book of the Law St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 3e4010a5 Recently, I have had the joy of having Aleister Crowley's, Book of the Law, opened to me. I want to share some of my thoughts with you about this. Perhaps these thoughts will turn into a commentary as I find my way more deeply into the beauties of this book. For now, I only want to share some of my very subjective responses to this beautiful little book. Some years ago through some idiot grace that may be manifesting her results now, Bill Hiedrick introduced me to Grady McMurtry, previous Caliph of O.T.O. At that time Grady showed me his signet ring given him by Crowley. I will never forget the impression of deep and powerful beauty that I got from that ring. I can see it now. The feeling was a green feeling. I sense the same soft, feathery green feeling as I read The Book of the Law. It is like a delicate grey mist, or streamers of pale green silk. It is a green feeling. Green is the color of illumination in Sufi land...some say because there is so little green in the austere, sun blasted desert. I heard an Arab wanderer say that the thing that impressed him the most about Minnesota was that it was so GREEN. Cairo is an Arab place where green means illumination. The ring and the book have a green aura for me. Perhaps the Book of the Law hides a pure light of illuminatin. Perhaps... --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (393) Fri 6 May 88 19:44 By: Hugh Read Of 282/341 To: All Re: The Pentagram St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:01a6 10a69d92 I invoke Ancient Powers of The Star The Powers of Five The Spiral Powers The Powers of Earth I invoke the Ancient Powers of Life Star in the Circle In the Iron Circle Quaint, ancient symbol So ancient, primordial and timeless Dark symbol of life On planets bearing life Deep in DNA Deeply branded in the Heart of our Earth Touchstone of Wisdom Of Ancient Knowledge, NOW, Living in the stars I call out through the Circled Iron Star For my Star Power Out through the Galaxies Claiming Dark Powers --- * Origin: The Terraboard, Minneapolis, MN (Opus 1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (394) Sat 7 May 88 17:58 By: Russ Anderson To: all Re: Invocation to Frigg St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 8f4610a7 When this invocation was first used, each person in a healing circle invoked a healer into (her/him)self. This was my invocation. The rest of the circle was asked to echo "Join us, Frigg" as I was saying "Join us. Frigg,". This was my first attempt at writing an invocation, and it DID work. I hope that it also works for anyone else who wishes to use it, because it now feels like time to share it. Blessed Be Russ Frigg, Daughter of Jord, Join us. Frigg, Daughter of Fiorgyn, Join us. Frigg, Wife of Odin, Join us. Frigg, Sister of Thorr, Join us. Frigg, Mother of Balder, Join us. Frigg, Mother of Hodr, Join us. Frigg, Mother of Hermod, Join us. Frigg, Mother of the gods, Join us. Frigg, Wise in all fates, Join us. Frigg, Who will tell no fortunes, Join us. Frigg, First among the Asynjur, Join us. Frigg, Queen of Asgard, Join us. Frigg, Mistress of home and hearth, Join us. Frigg, Mistress of Eir, Join us. Frigg, Mistress of healing, Join us. Frigg, Your servant _______ calls you! Come to me NOW! This invocation is being reposted as part of a group of invocations, most of which were patterned on this one. Permission is granted to use these invocations in your own rituals. I do ask, however, that I get credit in any copies of those rituals which are written or distributed. B*B Dragonfriend (Russ) --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (395) Sat 7 May 88 18:03 By: Russ Anderson To: all Re: invocation to Baldr St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 907210a7 "Baldr, Son of Frigg, Join us. Baldr, Son of Odin, Join us. Baldr, Husband of Nanna, Join us. Baldr, Brother of Hodr, Join us. Baldr, Brother of Hermod, Join us. Baldr, Father of Forsetti, Join us. Baldr, Slain by blind Hodr, Join us. Baldr, Master of Breidablik, Join us. Baldr, Who is much loved, Join us. Baldr, Who Thokk alone would not mourn, Join us. Baldr, The Fairest of the Aesir, Join us. Baldr, Whose Judgments stand unaltered, Join us. Baldr, Whose Judgments stand unheeded, Join us. Baldr, The Wisest of the Aesir, Join us. Baldr, The Shining One, Join us. Baldr, Your servant _______ calls you! Come to me NOW!" --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (396) Sat 7 May 88 18:04 By: Russ Anderson To: all Re: invocation to Freyja St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 909110a7 Freyja, Of the many names, Join us. Freyja, Of the golden tears, Join us. Freyja, Daughter of Njord, Join us. Freyja, Wife of Od, Join us. Freyja, Sister of Freyr, Join us. Freyja, Mother of Hnoss, Join us. Freyja, Claimed by Thrym, Join us. Freyja, Driver of cats, Join us. Freyja, Goddess of Fertility, Join us. Freyja, Who shares the slain with Odin, Join us. Freyja, Who taught the Aesir Magick, Join us. Freyja, Lender of Falcons' Flight, Join us. Freyja, Mistress of Brisingamen, Join us. Freyja, Mistress of Folkvang, Join us. Freyja, Mistress of nature, Join us. Freyja, Your servant _______ calls you! Come to me NOW! --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (397) Sat 7 May 88 18:05 By: Russ Anderson To: all Re: invocation to Thorr St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 90aa10a7 Thorr, Red-beard, Join us. Thorr, Son of J”rd, Join us. Thorr, Brother of Frigg, Join us. Thorr, Father of M”di, Join us. Thorr, Father of Magni, Join us. Thorr, Father of Thr£dr, Join us. Thorr, Husband of Sif, Join us. Thorr, J”tunn bane, Join us. Thorr, Foe of I”rmungandr, Join us. Thorr, Who bears Marriage Hallower, Join us. Thorr, Who bears Death Hallower, Join us. Thorr, Who wields Mj”llnir, Join us. Thorr, Defender of Asgard, Join us. Thorr, Thunderer, Join us. Thorr, Storm Lord, Join us. Thorr, Your servant _______ calls you! Come to me NOW! --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (398) Sat 7 May 88 18:06 By: Russ Anderson To: all Re: invocation to Freyr St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 90c510a7 HP: (both do "Freyr" and "Join us.") "Freyr, Son of Nj”rd, Join us. Freyr, Husband of Gerdr, Join us. Freyr, Brother of Freyja, Join us. Freyr, Father of kings, Join us. Freyr, Whose sword would fight for itself, Join us. Freyr, Who gave his sword for Gerdr, Join us. Freyr, Patron of married couples, Join us. Freyr, Most beautiful of Gods, Join us. Freyr, Whose tooth-gift was Alfheimr, Join us. Freyr, Master of Gullinbursti, Join us. Freyr, Owner of Skidbladnir, Join us. Freyr, Slayer of Beli, Join us. Freyr, Master of Frodi's Peace, Join us. Freyr, Who directs Man's good fortune, Join us. Freyr, Who brings fruitful seasons, Join us. Freyr, Your servant _______ calls you! Come to me NOW!" --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (399) Sat 7 May 88 18:07 By: Russ Anderson To: all Re: invocation to Herne St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 90e410a7 "Herne, Winter Lord, We, your children, call to you. Horned One, Hunter, We, your children, invite you here. Woodland Spirit, We, your children, ask your presence. Herne, Winter Lord, We, your children, call to you. Horned One, Hunter, We, your children, invite you here. Woodland Spirit, We, your children, ask your presence. Herne, Winter Lord, We, your children, call to you. Horned One, Hunter, We, your children, invite you here. Woodland Spirit, We, your children, ask your presence, NOW." --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (400) Sat 7 May 88 18:07 By: Russ Anderson To: all Re: invocation to Brigit St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 90f810a7 "Brigit, Wise One, We, your children, call to you. Lady, Smithy, We, your children, invite you here. Triple Goddess, We, your children, ask your presence. Brigit, Wise One, We, your children, call to you. Lady, Smithy, We, your children, invite you here. Triple Goddess, We, your children, ask your presence. Brigit, Wise One, We, your children, call to you. Lady, Smithy, We, your children, invite you here. Triple Goddess, We, your children, ask your presence, NOW." --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (401) Sun 15 May 88 8:49 By: Russ Anderson To: Meredydd Harper Re: Re: invocation to Herne St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 462410af mh> These are lovely, Russ, but they evoke a question: mh> why is it that it felt comfortable to *demand* that mh> Freya, Thor, Freyr, and Baldr appear, and yet not mh> comfortable to do the same with Herne? The tone of mh> the Herne invocation is *noticeably* gentler. Meredydd, Answer 1. I Don't know! Answer 2, despite the previous, ACCURATE answer, I'll attempt to speculate. I don't see those as demands, I see them, rather, as strongly worded requests. It is a tone that I simply had not seen in them (we ALL have blind spots). Since I'm not ready to tamper with success, you may well see other Norse invocations with the same tone. All of the Norse invocations were built to a pattern set by the Frigg invocation. (god/dess name, kenning, join us. times 15, god/dess name, Your servent _____ calls you, Come to me NOW!) This was my FIRST attempt at writing ANY piece of ritual. But it WORKS and seems to fit the god/desse/s of that mythos and their worshipers of old, etc. The Herne and Brigit invocations, along with a set of quarters invocations, came to me in the space of a few minutes as I was sitting in the bathroom thinking about what needed to be done for the Imbolc/Lady day/Brigit/... ritual that a friend and I were writing (We have half the wheel of the year so far. They will probably NOT be published as a whole, even here because Starhawk, Leigh Ann, and Raymond Buckland, at the very least, might have unfair use of copyrighted material claims. We drew on all of these sources and more in writing these rituals. At some future time, I will post the quarter invocations. My friend wrote 3 of the 4 sets we have (with some minor editing on my part [she hasn't asked for any changes in my invocations]) and I have her permission to post them. I feel like I should wait until we have the whole wheel before posting the quarters invocations. We have actually been using 5 quarters (NO MATH FLAMES will be accepted!); Earth, Air, Fire, Water, and Spirit/LifeForce - North, East, South, West, and Center respectivly, and we have been casting the circle from the appropriate quarter/cross quarter. We are lighting candles (no invocations) at NE, SE, SW, & NW. At Yule, we cast from North, at Brigit, from NE, etc. Center is invoked last, and "dismissed" first. B*B Dragonfriend (Russ) --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (402) Tue 24 May 88 13:28 By: Brad Hicks To: All Re: Book Review: Robert Anton Wilson, _Natural Law_ St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:0 229a44b3 A few months ago, I did something that I almost never do. I bought a book, sight unseen. It was a safe bet, of course, because I'm a Robert Anton Wilson fan and a completist; I knew for sure that his book _Natural Law, or, Don't Put a Rubber on Your Willy_ would be worth the $6.00 it was going to cost me. I was wrong. A little history behind this volume: three years ago someone named L.A. Rollins wrote a book called _The Myth of Natural Rights_ in which he (apparently) held forth on the extreme Social-Darwinist argument that there are no "rights" other than those you can grab and defend. Perhaps you can imagine what members of the Libertarian Party (as opposed to real libertarians) thought of this, and true-to-form, Murray Rothbard and George H. Smith wrote review articles for _New Libertarian_ entitled "On the Duty of Natural Outlaws to Shut Up" and "Roughing Up Rights," respectively. Apparently, Robert Anton Wilson wants to side with Rollins against the rest of the Libertarian Party, so he submitted a lengthy rebuttal of Rothbard and Smith to _New Libertarian_. And now he's very, very angry because Samuel Konkin, the editor of _New Libertarian_, had the unbridled temerity to edit an article submitted to his own magazine. Konkin's editing didn't change a word of Wilson's article, by the way. He merely footnoted it heavily with his own refutation of Wilson's refutation of Rothbard and Smith's refutations of Rollin's refutation of the existence of "natural rights." But this has so deeply angered Wilson that he has blown his article up into a slim volume (68 pages) and persuaded Loompanics to print it as if it had validity on its own and free-standing. So you see, _Natural Law_ is Robert Anton Wilson's refutation of Samuel Konkin's refutation of Robert Anton Wilson's refutation of Murray Rothbard's and George Smith's refutations of a book by L.A. Rollins, which is itself a refutation of the Deist notion of "natural rights." If you read the original book and the original articles in _New Libertarian_ and this issue is one of mind-numbing urgency to you, then possibly you might think that you can get your $6.00 worth out of this volume. You're probably wrong. Wilson's argument is far, far below his standards elsewhere, and consists primarily of Swiftian ridicule combined with gutter language. (Scarcely a page goes by without his describing some argument as "Ideal Platonic Horseshit." This gets very, very tiring.) Pass this one up. You won't be missing anything. (Robert Anton Wilson, _NATURAL LAW or Don't Put A Rubber On Your Willy_. Port Townsend, WA: Loompanics Unlimited, 1987. Trade paperback, 68 pages, $5.95.) --- Sirius 0.50 * Origin: WeirdBase * St. Louis * 1-314-741-2231 * (Opus 1:100/523) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (403) Tue 24 May 88 6:50 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: The Deva St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 364410b8 When a Deva descends...or rises up Within a human A god has come to rest To nest in a heart To brood without words over an old soul Of many lifetimes Giving quiet power Beyond that human Making that life a skillful game of love Healing and delight Guided by wise insight Through shadows and light What a subtle joy it is to see it In another's eyes To feel it in a heart That has grown so wise That it knows the tale before it is told And heals with a smile Hurts before they are felt Making us complete Even imperfections radiate love Sparks of rainbow light Twinkle through mistakes With happy mischief And we know it is alright...no harm meant It all rights itself What wonderful good luck To have a deva --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (404) Tue 24 May 88 6:57 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: The Deva, II St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 372e10b8 The deva is beautiful and cunning She gives ecstacy Unlimited healing As she does her work Her implacable power holds terror That shimmers like ice In the dry arctic Sun's Frozen rainbow fields Her tenderness in curiosity Relaxes to lust Of a sly beast of prey From other dimensions --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (405) Tue 24 May 88 7:10 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: A Special Kind of Healing St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 394010b8 Most non-human in their complications The other-minded Learn secrets of healing To cover their tracks They feed on pain of human souls dying Giving them more life They feed on disease Letting health increase Their strange gift is healing for all Their food is sickness They gain strength from weakness Leaving the weak strong Stronger themselves from eating the weakness Fungus of the soul That is a special food For these strange healers The mind parasites sapping others strength Are these healers Food of immortality The food of their gods --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (406) Tue 24 May 88 7:19 By: Hugh Read To: All Re: Avalokitsvara, or a crystal is not a diamond St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:c712 3a7010b8 The crystal Kuan Yin Rooted within a human Quiet ecstacy That ancient being Neither man nor a woman Rainbow ecstacy Healing other planes Yielding non-human delight Clear light ecstacy The crystal Kuan Yin Rooted in man or woman Timeless ecstacy The crystal Kuan Yin Rooted within a human Divine ecstacy Divine Unity Within the crystal Kuan Yin The Crystal Body The Crystal body The Crystal Kuan Yin in my heart Crystal ecstacy --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: The Terraboard, Mpls MN (1:282/341) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (407) Sun 29 May 88 1:51 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: laws (1 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 e7d10bd YOUR HIGH PRIESTESS In the Magic Circle, the words, commands, and wishes of the High Priestess are Law. She is the earthly representative of our gracious Goddess. She is to be obeyed and respected in all things. She is our Lady and, above all others, a Queen in the highest sense of the word. All female coveners will curtsy and say "Blessed Be" when they come before Her, and all male coveners will bend their knee and kiss Her on the right cheek and say "Blessed Be". YOUR HIGH PRIEST In the Magic Circle, the High Priest is the earthly representative of the Great God. He commands the respect due a Magus, Lord Counselor, and father. THE LAWS THE LAWS WERE MADE FOR THE WITCHES TO ADVISE THEM IN THEIR TROUBLES. DO NOT CHANGE THEM LIGHTLY. 1. The Witches should worship the Gods as is their due, and obey their will. For the worship of the Gods is good for the Witches even as the worship of the Witches is good for the Gods: For the Gods love all their Witches. 2. As a man loves a woman more by acquiring more knowledge of her wants and desires, so should the Witches love the Gods by the learning (mastering) of them. 3. It is necessary that the Magic Circle, which is the Temple of the Gods in these times, be case and purified such that it may be a fitting place for the Gods; and the Witches should be properly prepared and purified to enter into the presence of the Gods. 4. With love and worship in their hearts the Witches shall raise power from their bodies (and the elements around them), and they shall offer this power to the Gods so that the Gods may help their Witches. 5. The High Priestess shall rule her coven as the representative of the Goddess, and the High Priest shall support her as the representative of the God. The High Priestess will choose any member of the coven to be her High Priest, if he has sufficient standing in the cover. As the God Himself kissed our Lady's feet, gave Her the five-fold salute, and offered Her His power because of Her youth and beauty, Her sweetness and kindness, Her wisdom and justice, Her humility, gentleness, and generosity, and shared His power with Her, so therefore the High Priestess should always be aware that all power comes from Him; it is only lent, to be used wisely and justly. 6. The greatest virtue of a High Priestess shall be recognition that youth is necessary to the representative of the Goddess. She will, therefore, gracefully retire in favor of a younger covener should the coven so decide in council. The true High Priestess should realize that gracefully surrendering the pride of place is one of the greatest virtues, and that thereby she will return to that pride of place in another life with even greater power and beauty. --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (408) Sun 29 May 88 1:53 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: Laws (2 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 eb810bd 7. In the Old Days, when there were many Witches, we were free and worshipped freely in the greatest temples; but in these times, we must celebrate our sacred mysteries in secret. Therefore, none but the Witches is to see our mysteries; no coven shall know the location of any other coven or who its members are, except the High Priest, the High Priestess, and the Messenger; and that there shall be no communication among the covens, except by the Messenger of the Gods or the Summoner. Only if it is safe may the covens meet in some safe place for the Great Festivals; and while there, none shall give their true names or any information about their coven or its members. This law is made for this reason: no one can tell our enemies what they do not themselves know. 8. It is ordained that no one shall tell any person not in the Craft who other Witches are, or give them names, or addresses, or in any way tell anything that can betray a Witch to their face. Nor may anyone tell where the covendom or covenstead is, where any meetings are held, or any other information about the coven unless directed to do so by the coven in council. 9. If anyone breaks these laws, even under torture, may the Curse of the God and the Goddess be upon them, so that they may not be reborn upon the Earth (but shall live forever in the Hell of the Christians). 10. Let each High Priest and High Priestess govern their coven with justice and love, with the help and advice of the other and of the elders of the coven, always heeding the advice of the Messenger of the Gods if he should arrive. They will heed all the suggestions of their coveners and strive to settle any differences among them. 11. It is recognized that there will always be people who will try to make everybody agree with their ideas: these people are not necessarily bad --they often have good ideas, and these ideas should be discussed in council. But if they will not come to agree with their other coveners, or if they say, "I will not work with this High Priestess," then the elders will have them leave. It should be suggested that they might join another coven, or if they are of sufficient standing they may be encouraged to found their own coven. For it is better this way, to avoid strife among the family of Witches. --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (409) Sun 29 May 88 1:55 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: laws (3 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 efa10bd 12. When using geographic boundaries, whenever anyone of Third Degree lives more than a league from the covenstead (or are about to), any of these may found a new coven; indeed, any Witch living within the covenstead who wishes to form a new coven will inform the elders of this intention, and immediately move to a new dwelling beyond the boundaries of known covensteads. Members of any coven may choose to join the new coven when it is formed, but they must totally avoid their old coven if they choose this course. The elders of the old and new covens should meet in peace and love to determine the boundaries of the covens. Any Witch living outside of any two covens may choose to join either coven, but never both. All may meet for the Great Festivals if the elders agree, so long as they meet in peace and love. Let the elders confer as to the use of this law when it is not directly applicable. Always be aware that the splitting of a coven breeds bad feelings; this law was made chiefly for this reason. And may happier times come! 13. If you would keep a Book (whether it is called a Black Book, Book of Shadows, Book of Light, or whatever), write it in your own hand. Let your brothers and sisters in the Craft copy as they will from your book in their hand, but never let your Book out of your hands and never keep the writing of another. Every Witch should keep and guard their own writings, that none may be discovered through their Book being found in another's possession. 14. Destroy your Book whenever danger threatens, and commit as many as possible of these Laws to memory. Destroy the writings of a deceased Witch if they did not have time to do so themselves. If any of their writings are found, it is clear proof against both the writer and the holder, for our enemies firmly believe that "one may not be a Witch alone": their family and all who are known to be friends may be suspected as Witches. Be responsible with your writings and you will protect all who love you. 15. If your Book is found on you, it is clear proof against you alone unless you tell our enemies what you know. You may be taken and tortured, but keep all thoughts of the Craft from your mind. If the torture is too much to bear, tell them, "I cannot bear this torture. I will confess. What do you want me to say?" If they try to make you talk about the Craft, do not; but if they try to make you speak of absurd things, such as flying through the air, consorting with the Christian devil, sacrificing children, or eating men's flesh, say, "I held an evil dream; I was beside myself; I was crazed," or words to that effect, to obtain relief from the torture. Not all magistrates are bad -- if there is any semblance of an excuse, they may show mercy. If you have confessed to anything, deny it afterwards: say that you babbled under torture, or that you don't remember what you said. If you are condemned, do not be afraid, for the Craft is powerful and your escape will be aided if you stand fast. If you go steadfast to the flames, be certain that drugs will reach you and you will feel nothing of the pain. You will only go to death and what lies beyond -- the ecstasy of the God and the Goddess. If you betray anything, however, there is no hope for you in this life or that which is to come. --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (410) Sun 29 May 88 1:58 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: laws (4 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 f5210bd 16. To avoid being discovered, choose your working tools to be ordinary items which you would have around the house. Make your Pentacles out of wax so that you can break and melt them at once. Do not keep a sword unless its presence would alarm no one. Have no signs or names visible on anything: write the signs in ink or water immediately before consecrating the tool, and wash them off immediately after. Do not engrave anything, for this will only help you be discovered. Keep your athame and kerfan (working knife) among your kitchen knives, and let the colors of the hilts determine the one from the other and from the other knives. Always remember that we are the Hidden Children of the Goddess. Never do anything to disgrace the Craft or Her --never boast, never threaten, and never say that you wish ill of anyone. 17. It is not forbidden to say, "There is Witchcraft in the land," for the Christians say so themselves and have made it heresy not to believe so; but always say, "I know nothing of it here, though it may be elsewhere." If any person speaks about the Craft outside of the Circle, say, "Don't speak of such things -- it frightens me. It is bad luck to talk about such things." Say this for this reason: the Christians have their spies everywhere. These spies have been known to talk as if they were drawn to the Craft and as if they would want to come to our meetings, and they say such things as, "My fathers and forefathers worshipped the Old Ones, and my mother; I would like to worship in this way myself." To all of these, tell them that you do not know what they are talking about, and that you wish they would stop. But to others, say, "It's silly to talk about Witches flying around in the air; they would have to be lighter than feathers or thistle-down. Besides, everyone knows that Witches are all bleary-eyed old hags; what fun could they possibly have at their meetings, and why should I want to participate? And besides, you know we were taught in school that there are no such things as Witches." Always make fun of the subject, that we may worship in peace when the persecution ends: let us all work for that happy time. May the blessing of the God and the Goddess be upon all who keep this law. 18. If any in the Craft holds any property, let all Witches guard it and keep it clear and good for the use of the Craft. It is the further responsibility of all Witches to guard Craft funds wisely. 19. If any Witch offers a well-made item, it is proper to pay them for it according to the value of the work; this is not taking money for the Craft, but payment for honest work -- even the Christians believe that "the labourer is worth his hire". Still, if any Witch works willingly for the good of the Craft and will not accept payment, this shall be to their greater honor. --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (411) Sun 29 May 88 2:00 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: laws (5 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 100f10bd 20. It is known that a coven may be bound together by sexual ties, and that this is often not desirable. When it is found that this is not desirable, the coven should be made up of loving couples, and there may also be single coveners. In such cases, it is required that the search for new love be undertaken outside the coven except when two single coveners find love with each other; otherwise, it will often cause division in the coven. For while all acts of love and pleasure are indeed the rituals of our beloved Goddess, She is not inclined to favor acts which divide her covens and scatter Her Witches unnecessarily. 21. If there should arise quarrels or disputes among the Witches, the High Priestess or High Priest shall immediately convene the elders and inquire into the problem. The elders shall hear each side separately, and then both together. Their decision should be just, not siding with one side until the matter is determined, recognizing that there are people who cannot work under others, and others who cannot make wise decisions. To those who must always be in charge, the possible solutions for them are to void the coven alto-gether, find another coven for them, or for them to found a new coven (taking with them all who will go). To those who cannot rule wisely, the solution is that those who cannot bear the rule will leave the coven. No one can truly worship the Gods when personal conflicts among the coveners are not resolved; all who cause strife in the coven must be told, "Go away from us, for the Craft must ever survive." 22. In the Old Days, we could use the Art against anyone who treated the Witches badly; but in these times, we must not do so. Our enemies have invented a burning pit of everlasting fire into which their God throws everyone who does not worship Him, except for those few who buy their penance from His priests (for their God always seems to be in need of money). Even as our Gods need our aid to make fertility for people and crops, so it is that the God of the Christians is always needing men to find and destroy us. Their priests tell them that any man who is helped by us will be damned to their Hell forever, to the point that men are mad with the terror of it. But the priests also make them believe that they may escape this Hell if they give up Witches to be tortured, so that these men are always thinking, "If I catch only one Witch, I will escape the fiery pit." For this reason we have our hiding places, and when no Witches are found, the searchers will say, "There aren't any Witches, or at least not in this area." But as soon as one of our oppressors dies or even catches a cold, the cry will go up that it is "Witches' work", and the hunt will be on again. And while they may kill ten Christians for every Witch, they will not care, for they are countless millions while we are few indeed. 23. THEREFORE, IT IS ORDAINED that none shall use the Art in any way to harm anyone or even wish them ill. However much they may injure us, HARM NONE, and may the Christians forget that we exist. --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (412) Sun 29 May 88 2:02 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: laws (6 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 105110bd 24. These laws are ordained to help us in our difficulties. No person, no matter how large the injury or injustice they incur, may use the Art in any way to do evil or harm anyone. But they may use the Art, after great consul-tation with the elders and fellow coveners, to keep the Christians and their tools from harming anyone -- but only to constrain them. To this end, some day men will say, "That man says he is a mighty persecutor of Witches, but all we ever see him torture are old women -- we cannot see that they have hurt anyone, and if they are all such powerful Witches, why has he not been harmed?" They will see him as an evil person regardless of his professed beliefs. We know that too many people have died because someone had a grudge against them, or were persecuted because another wanted their wealth or because they were too poor to bribe the witch-hunters. And many have died only for being old women -- so many that most men now seem to believe that only old women are Witches. This is to our advantage, for it turns many suspicious eyes away from us; but we mourn deeply for the old women. Still, in England and Scotland, it has been hundreds of years since a Witch "died the death"; be vigilant, for the misuse of our power might begin the persecutions again. Never break this law no matter how much you are tempted. Never consent to the breaking of this law: even a High Priestess who merely consents to the breaking of this law must be deposed immediately, for it is the blood of all the Witches that she endangers. DO ONLY GOOD, and then only when it is safe to do anything at all. 25. Never accept money for the use of the Art, for money always smudges the receiver. Christians take money for the use of their arts, and they sell pot-metal charms, pardons, and potions to men so that they may escape from their sins. Do not act like these men; as long as you refuse to take money, you will be free from the temptation to use the Art for evil causes. All may use the Art for their own advantages, or for the advantage of the Craft, but you must always be certain that no one will be harmed by its use. Let the coven debate the use of the Art at length, and only when all are satisfied that none will be harmed by its use will the use be allowed. Remember that if you cannot achieve your means in one fashion, your aim may still be reached through another -- always harming none. 26. If anyone in the Craft needs a house or land and there is no one willing to sell to them, you may use the Art to incline an owner's mind to be willing to sell, provided that the spell does not harm the owner or the property and that the full value is paid without haggling. Never bargain or cheapen anything wile living by the Art. 27. The most important of laws: Do nothing that will endanger anyone in the Craft or which will bring them into conflict with the law of the land or any of our persecutors. In this regard, it is NEVER permissible, in any dispute involving the Craft, to invoke any laws other than those of the Craft, nor may any tribunals be held other than one consisting of the High Priestess, the High Priest, and the elders. --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (413) Sun 29 May 88 2:04 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: laws (7 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 109110bd 28. The coven is to keep two books on herbalism: one of these will list the names and uses of all herbs which are cures for ills or are otherwise good for humans, and all may have access to this book to learn these things. But keep a separate book with the names of all poisonous herbs and those used in dark spells, letting only the elders and other trusted Witches know of these secrets or even of this book's existence. 29. Remember that the Art is the secret of the Gods and may only be used in earnest -- never for show, or pride, or personal glory. The Christians may taunt you saying, "You have no power: Perform some magic for us, and then we may believe." Do not listen to them, for the Art is holy and is to be used only in need. 30. It has always been the way of men and women that they should seek after love, and while no one should be reproved for this, it may be to the disad-vantage of the Craft sometimes. It has happened too many times that a High Priestess has found a new love and run off with him, giving no word to the coven of this. A High Priestess may resign in full coven at any time, and this resignation is valid; but if she has not resigned, the coven shall wait for her to return for a year and a day (for she may return sooner, having left for love). If she has a deputy, that deputy is to act as Priestess for as long as the High Priestess is away. If she returns within this time, all will be as if she had never left; but if she does not return within this time, a new High Priestess shall be elected in full coven. Unless there is a good reason to the contrary, the deputy, having done the work, should reap the reward and be chose as the new High Priestess. But if another is chosen, the deputy shall be the maiden and deputy of the new High Priestess. 31. The High Priest serves at the pleasure of the High Priestess. If the High Priestess is gone for more than a year and a day, he shall continue in his office while the deputy serves in her place. However, once a new High Priestess has been chosen, the new High Priestess will appoint her own High Priest (and it may be the current High Priest or not). Neither the prior High Priest nor his friends may be angry if a new High Priest is chose, for pride must always give way to harmony in the coven. 32. The Art is sacred: it is the Art of the working of energies, and it must always be taught inside of the Magic Circle. It has been found that teaching the Art frequently leads to a sexual attraction between the teacher and student -- and that this often improves the result. If for any reason this is not desirable, it should be avoided at the beginning by both persons firmly - and verbally - resolving that their relations will be limited to that of brother and sister, or parent and child. It is for the reason that shared love often increases the result of working magic that teaching should always be done from man-to-woman and from woman-to-man. When a coven is made up of members of all one sex, the masculine-to-feminine energy exchange should be adhered to whenever possible. Teaching people about the Craft, however, may be done whenever and wherever it is safe, so long as the teacher is knowledgeable, the student is willing, and the information taught is available publicly or is not a secret of the Art. No one may charge for teaching, unless it is to cover such expenses as the cost of the room, books or other printed materials, refreshments, and so forth. --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (414) Sun 29 May 88 2:06 By: J_Random Folksinger To: all Re: laws (8 of 8) St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:d466 10c610bd 33. Order and discipline must be kept within the coven: the High Priestess of the High Priest should and may punish all faults. To this end, all in the Craft should receive their correction willingly. With the culprit kneeling, all in the Circle should be told of the offense, and the sentence will be pronounced. Punishment might include the scourge or the recasting of the Circle, followed by something silly such as several kisses. The culprit must acknowledge the justice of the punishment by kissing the scourge upon receiving sentence, and afterward by thanking everyone for their loving correction. SO MOTE IT BE! Note to MagickNet friends and acquaintances: The above is a combination of what I was taught and what I learned. Many different sources, including my NeoGardnerian training, two different sets of Celtic Craft laws, four versions found in print, and the picked brains of several of my students, went into it. (J. Random Folksinger) --- Sirius 0.50 --- ConfMail V3.31 * Origin: Dragonfriend's Point (1:104/904.5) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (415) Fri 17 Jun 88 21:30 By: Mordecai Shapiro To: Ammond Shadowcraft Re: Re: Historical Jesus, part iv St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:0ac0 10d1abd6 RECOMMENDED FOR FURTHER READING Maccoby, Hyam, "The Mythmaker: Paul and the invention of Christianity" Harper & Row 1986. -- presents some new historical criticism in the light of Talmudic scholarship. clear, vivid writing throughout. --- * Origin: ThelemaNet - Hail Eris! * (415) 548-0163 (Opus 1:161/93) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (416) Fri 17 Jun 88 21:35 By: Mordecai Shapiro To: All Re: Poem St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:0ac0 10d1ac7c I am the Anticrowley here to abolish all necrophile-sycophants who suck dry marrow from long-dead bones and leave fresh sap of the world-ash to feed mere fungi, molds, bacteria, and snails. Hear me, ye Crowleyan fans and bigots, the lowliest creatures of slime are nobler than you! For instead of turning shit to life, you turn the brightest shining gold to puerile turds of deadest lead. You spurn the truth that Man is God and waste your worship on a fat old fraud. I am the Anticrowley and I am angry that even the word of Will is bent by you, not into a fitting yoke of discipline, but into links to forge a chain to bind yourselves to another's brain. I am the Anticrowley. I peck at the eyes of Aleister as he dies in purple ecstasy. I spit on your crapulous creed! --- * Origin: ThelemaNet - Hail Eris! * (415) 548-0163 (Opus 1:161/93) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (417) Mon 20 Jun 88 10:23 By: Rowan Moonstone To: Hugh Read Re: Re: Hawaiian Myths St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:ee8a 52e010d4 Actually, this is the posting for ths chants that Devin did. My sysop hasn't taken off therestrictions on posting on Mataphysical so the only way I can get them in is to do it in "reply" mode. Sorry. God verses for the "Lady's Branle" on the Gwydion "Songs for the Olde Religion" The Hunter's call He leads in Fall Through leaf and thorny brier. In winter's cold He guards the hold And harps beside the fire. His children sing sweet in the spring The fields are in His keeping. He beards the corn that's summer born. Ale's power lies a'sleeping." words by Devin Storm Lady weave Your Circle Chant (Goddess verse given to me by Lady Phoenix coven of Our Lady of the Inner Sea, Dallas ,Tex. God verse by Devin Storm, harper to Coven Amber Moon, OKC> OK Lady weave your circle tight. Spin a web of glowing light. Earth and air, fire and water Bind us to you. Father in the coming night Gather in your ancient might. Sage and warrior,Horned hunter. Guide us to You. --- QuickBBS v2.01 * Origin: On The Edge BBS - (405)848-2828 - OKC's only source for MAGI (1:147/4 --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (418) Sat 25 Jun 88 0:13 By: L.a. Hussey To: J_Random Folksinger Re: The Laws St: --------------------------------------------------------------------------- @EID:0ac0 10d901b0 I am disturbed and disappointed. "The Christians are our enemies." "They will torture you to make you talk about the Craft." "Lie about the Craft." "Covens splitting up makes for bad feelings." What depressing garbage. This is the 20th century, and this is America, this is not Inquisition days. The more we keep secret, the more the ignorant will assume that we have horrible secrets to keep. The true secrets of the Gods cannot be given away, because they cannot be spoken -- they are beyond all language. And as for bad feelings when covens break up, maybe that is how it is where you are, but around here, there is rejoicing when one coven becomes two. Seems to me like my best possible response to your "Laws" is the following song: BURNING TIMES The songs are sung to rouse our anger of martyred Witches gone to the fires, But what is served by righteous singing, if all we do is stew in our ire? Nine million dead in four hundred years; More in that time simply died of disease. Why do we dwell on long past dead When we are alive in times like these? (cho) Rise up, Witches, throw off your masks And cease crying guilt for ancient crimes. Earth and all Her children need us For ALL face now the Burning Times. In the face of that hostile power, how did the old knowledge stay alive? How have we still a Craft to practise? Our ancestors knew how to fight and survive! How do we honour our blessed dead? Slavery threatens us all but few. We must teach their cunning ways -- EVERYONE needs the skills they knew! (cho2) Rise up, Witches, gather your strength, And let your power spread and climb; Earth and all Her children need us For ALL face now the Burning Times. I will not cast off Science's works -- Witches all forces to Will can bend; I'll not accuse for war and waste some patriarchy of faceless men. Men do not cast the only votes; Women alone do not demonstrate. Rather than shut out half the race, Who if not we will change that state? (cho2) I will not blame a Father's Church -- blame and guilt are their tools, not mine, And even in the shuls and churches, allies there will I seek, and find! I will not answer hate with fear, Nor with a smug, cheek-turning love. I will not answer hate with rage; By strength alone will I not be moved! (cho2) (cont'd next msg) --- * Origin: ThelemaNet - Hail Eris! * (415) 548-0163 (Opus 1:161/93) --------------------------------------------------------------------------- (4