Original Message Date: 28 Mar 92 00:01:55 From: Uucp on 1:125/555 To: Tom Jennings on 1:125/111 Subj: Freely available ISDN interface project ^AINTL 1:125/111 1:125/555 From kumr!toad.com!gnu From: gnu@toad.com To: tom@toad.com (Tom Jennings), mkapor@eff.org (Mitch Kapor), Date: Fri, 27 Mar 92 11:49:23 -0800 Cc: gnu@toad.com (John Gilmore), pozar@toad.com (Tim Pozar), You-all have expressed interest in working on freely available implementations of software that would interface common computers to ISDN. It is worth exploring whether you-all are interested in collaborating on a freely available ISDN protocol implementation in C. This would cause the production of ISDN-ready products to explode, and make these products much more usable because they'd be more highly integrated. By `freely available', I mean public domain source code, or copyrighted source code with unlimited, royalty-free distribution permitted (such as with UC Berkeley software). Much current work makes ISDN look like a slightly faster modem, with ISDN protocol processing isolated in an expensive ``modem'' connected to the computer over a low performance serial port. High speed ISDN interfaces will be sitting on a single chip on many computers' motherboards by the end of the year, and plug-in cards for PC's and such are already available. Software that can directly interface to ISDN and use it for networking, voicemail, high speed fax, eventual speech recognition, and such would be a vast improvement over the ``modem'' model. I know that Tom and Ted have the technical skills needed to work on the project (perhaps John Reilly too -- we haven't met). What we lack is funding and a clear direction. Tom has been doing some consulting with Saskatchewan Tel on hooking up Hayes ISDN modems to IBM PC's. Mitch is `marketing' and proselytizing to a variety of companies (including telcos) about funding ISDN and accelerating its spread. Among us all, it should be possible to connect these people and ideas and funds into something that will quickly bring ISDN into every product and research project that can use it. Are you interested? John Gilmore PS: My own company has discovered that it's not hard to make money providing support and improvements to a free product -- after it has been written and has gotten into active use in many companies. ------- Forwarded Messages (FYI) To: Ted Lemon Cc: mkapor@eff.org, gnu@toad.com Subject: Re: ISDN... Date: Wed, 05 Feb 92 19:20:36 -0800 From: gnu@toad.com > Is there any PD software out there for handling the terminal adapter > connection signaling - i.e., telling the CO who to connect your lines to, > answering calls, and so on? DEC now has a machine that has something that > provides either the Terminal Adapter capability, or that plus the NT1 > capability (I don't know enough about ISDN yet to be sure which) on the base > system, and it lists for $3995 in a monochrome diskless configuration. I don't know of any PD software for handling ISDN call setup and teardown. I have heard that it is very hairy and complicated software, too. The latest twist is to have "ISDN modems" which do the call setup and teardown for you, using "AT" commands. There is a draft standard for this. DC Hayes has been working hard on this stuff, and you can contact their ISDN office in San Francisco at +1 415 974 5544. Try talking to Bill Taylor, though he will try to charge you $125 for the specs. Tell him what he's full of and see if you can get the standards committee contact name instead. Mitch, one thing to pitch as you talk to ISDN vendors and suppliers, would be that a free implementation in source code would greatly expand the market for ISDN over the next few years, just as the free implementation of TCP/IP in Berkeley Unix (work funded by DARPA) resulted in an explosion of high quality TCP/IP implementations. Either a vendor could release their source code, or some telco (perhaps BellCore?) might be willing to fund the writing of a free one. John ------- End of Forwarded Message Date: Wed, 18 Mar 92 16:10 WET From: JMREILLY@ccvax.ucd.ie To: isdn@list.prime.com Message-Id: <83A1264C279FC07566@ccvax.ucd.ie> Our research group is currently working on a project that will involve implementation of the forthcomming ETSI (European Telecommunications Standards Institute) ISDN PCI (Programmable Communications Interface). We would like to find out if anybody has IMPLEMENTED any of the existing ISDN APIs/PCIs such as COM/APPLI,APPLI/COM,CAPI or the North American ISDN Users Forum Application Software Interface (ASI). Any information relating to the above would be much appreciated and if anyone who has carried out (or intends to carry out) such an implementation would like to cooperate with us we would be extremely grateful. John Reilly Address: Computer Networks & Distributed Systems Research Group, Department Of Computer Science, University College Dublin, Belfield, Dublin 4. Phone: 353-1-7062488. Fax: 353-1-2697262 Email: jmreilly@ccvax.ucd.ie Original Message Date: 28 Mar 92 00:01:58 From: Uucp on 1:125/555 To: Tomj on 1:125/111 Subj: Re: Freely available ISDN interface project ^AINTL 1:125/111 1:125/555 From kumr!pozar From: pozar@kumr.lns.com (Tim Pozar) To: gnu@toad.com Date: Fri, 27 Mar 92 12:41:05 PST Cc: tom@toad.com, mkapor@eff.org, mellon@pa.dec.com, jmreilly@ccvax.ucd.ie, I would love to work on this project. About a year to two years ago, I was looking into using ISDN for passing IP to/from The Little Garden to/from me. I lined up the boxes from Hayes (Hayes' development for ISDN is here in SF) and was stopped when I found that the local CO would not be supporting ISDN for at least three years down the line. (They kept suggesting that I move my "office" to an area where PacBell has ISDN support.) (Hmmm, this message has prompted me to give a call to my ISDN contact at PacBell and see what the status is on the COs in SF is. I will follow up to this list.) If I can get ISDN here at home, with hopefully some one else I can bang the boxes against (e.g. TJ) I would make the project one of my higher prioity projects. Its up to the PacBell gods as when the CO will be supporting ISDN. Tim Original Message Date: 28 Mar 92 00:02:02 From: Uucp on 1:125/555 To: Tomj on 1:125/111 Subj: Re: Freely available ISDN interface project ^AINTL 1:125/111 1:125/555 From kumr!uunet.UU.NET!lupine!mellon From: lupine!mellon@uunet.UU.NET (Ted Lemon) To: pozar@kumr.lns.com (Tim Pozar) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 92 12:58:01 PST Cc: gnu@toad.com, tom@toad.com, mkapor@eff.org, mellon@Pa.dec.com, I think ISDN is available in San Francisco now. PacBell upgraded the CO software in Palo Alto just before the ISDN release came out, and they don't like to upgrade COs very often, so Palo Alto is pretty much the only place in Silly Valley that doesn't have ISDN and won't have it in the near future. Mountain View, where I work, has ISDN, and so does Sunnyvale, where I'm hoping to move soon. Even La Honda (my current home) should have it by the end of 1992. The only catch is that it's not tariffed for single line use yet - you have to buy a Centrex, with a minimum of two lines. The total setup cost is around $900 for the Centrex and the two lines; the cost per month is about $25 per line, for a total of $50. The PacBell rep that I've been dealing with thinks that the new tariff may be out this year, but didn't want to make any promises... _MelloN_ Original Message Date: 28 Mar 92 00:02:06 From: Uucp on 1:125/555 To: Tom Jennings on 1:125/111 Subj: Re: Freely available ISDN interface project ^AINTL 1:125/111 1:125/555 From kumr!uunet.UU.NET!lupine!mellon From: lupine!mellon@uunet.UU.NET (Ted Lemon) To: gnu@toad.com Date: Fri, 27 Mar 92 12:53:10 PST Cc: tom@toad.com (Tom Jennings), mkapor@eff.org (Mitch Kapor), I am definitely interested! I already have hardware for the project donated by DEC; I still need to finish making BSD work on it, but that's mostly done. This is a description that I've written up about what I want to do with ISDN (This is part of an addendum to my employee agreement at NCD): It is my intention, once I have 4.4BSD working reliably on my home machine, to implement an ISDN driver for the ISDN port which is built in to the machine. This driver will allow a user to make both digital and audio connections over ISDN to other ISDN connections and, in the case of audio connections, to non-ISDN telephones. The software will also be able to answer incoming audio calls, play a message, record a message, and handle commands entered in to an audio phone via DTMF (Touch Tone). Since the ISDN connection being supported is a 2B+D connection, it will be possible to perform any of the functions mentioned above on two seperate channels. The software may further be able to perform such functions as remote caller identification, which may be used to trigger different responses depending on the identity of the calling station; possible responses include selective forwarding, selective voice mail, and selective presentation of incoming calls for answering by a human. This will most likely be accomplished through the use of a shell script or shell scripts which are passed the caller's identification on the command line; thus, any sort of action which can be taken by the system can be selectively triggered based on the ID of an incoming call. What I didn't mention is that I want to run IP over the digital connection - a 64kilobaud single-streaming modem isn't very useful. My main obstacles right now are that I don't have access to a standards document telling me what protocol to speak, and that I don't have a test bed - you're not allowed to test your software on the network; you have to get it certified at PacBell first. PacBell seems eager to help stimulate development, though, so I'm hoping that they'll give me access to their test equipment from time to time during implementation. Needless to say, there's a lot of work to be done here, so I'd rather have other people working with me on it! _MelloN_ Original Message Date: 28 Mar 92 00:02:08 From: Uucp on 1:125/555 To: Tom Jennings on 1:125/111 Subj: Re: Freely available ISDN interface project ^AINTL 1:125/111 1:125/555 From kumr!eff.org!mkapor From: mkapor@eff.org (Mitch Kapor) To: tom@toad.com (Tom Jennings), mkapor@eff.org (Mitch Kapor), Date: Fri, 27 Mar 1992 21:16:29 -0500 Cc: gnu@toad.com (John Gilmore), pozar@toad.com (Tim Pozar), EFF would be interested in (1) serving as a principal FTP site for such a project, and (2) "marketing" and promoting it. We'd also be able to serve as a test site for the software, as we expect to have ISDN linking our office to staff members' homes soon. Original Message Date: 05 Apr 92 09:46:45 From: Uucp on 1:125/555 To: Tomj on 1:125/111 Subj: Re: Freely available ISDN interface project ^AINTL 1:125/111 1:125/555 From kumr!pozar From: pozar@kumr.lns.com (Tim Pozar) To: lupine!mellon@uunet.UU.NET (Ted Lemon) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 92 11:20:42 PST Cc: lupine!gnu@toad.com, lupine!tom@toad.com, lupine!mkapor@eff.org, Ted Lemon wrote: > I think ISDN is available in San Francisco now. > [...] > The only catch is that it's not tariffed for single line use yet - > you have to buy a Centrex, with a minimum of two lines. The total > setup cost is around $900 for the Centrex and the two lines; the cost > per month is about $25 per line, for a total of $50. The PacBell rep > that I've been dealing with thinks that the new tariff may be out this > year, but didn't want to make any promises... > > _MelloN_ This was confirmed by a PacBell employee this last Friday. You need Centrex to get ISDN and you need to get at least two loops. Tim -- Internet: pozar@kumr.lns.com FidoNet: Tim Pozar @ 1:125/555 UUCP: ...!uunet!kumr.lns.com!pozar Snail: Tim Pozar / KKSF / 77 Maiden Lane / San Francisco CA 94108 / USA Voice: +1 415 788 2022 Original Message Date: 11 Jul 92 23:50:22 From: Uucp on 1:125/555 To: Tom Jennings on 1:125/111 Subj: [dap@aberystwyth.ac.uk: WAS : Re: IP over Circuit ISDN EVOLUTION FROM T ^AINTL 1:125/111 1:125/555 From kumr!toad.com!gnu From: gnu@toad.com To: tom@toad.com Date: Sat, 11 Jul 92 18:15:21 -0700 This is a great idea. I guess the ISDN TA's from Hayes can't do it. You need a real ISDN interface (that hands you all the bits) so you can reinterpret it to analog and then decode it like a modem. But it's a great hack if you have a DSP handy (or can route the ISDN audio into a modem chip). John ------- Forwarded Message To: iplpdn@NRI.Reston.VA.US Cc: "k1io, FN42jk" , isdn@list.prime.com, rjg@aberystwyth.ac.uk, dap@aberystwyth.ac.uk, brc@aberystwyth.ac.uk, tsh@aberystwyth.ac.uk Subject: WAS : Re: IP over Circuit ISDN EVOLUTION FROM THE PAST In-Reply-To: Your message of "Thu, 09 Jul 92 13:41:46 +0200." Date: Thu, 09 Jul 92 10:41:38 +0100 From: dap@aberystwyth.ac.uk Dear All, I have been considering 'evolution' and the introduction of an ISDN service. Clearly, many users are presently using modems, others will start using ISDN by means of V110 (etc) terminal adaptors. I believe that it will prove useful to accept calls from each of the above situations on an ISDN interface that can also accept all the link level protocols being addressed in the MLP discussions. What does this imply? Well, all the old modem standards only generate 'voice style' frequencies on the wire. Thus, if the modem call starts on an analogue network, it should be able to call into the ISDN network where it will be specifying a 'voice' capable channel. It is clearly possible that if we accepted the byte stream, we could, in software, recreate the original bit stream that entered the modem. Similarly (and more easily) we can clearly handle V110 in software too. Why do I wish to do this? Simply I wish to establish an 'evolution strategy' I want to be able to make all my new investment in ISDN, but still be able to support 'home' and other remote users who have modems or who buy TAs without having to buy them all new ISDN cards too..... I really dont want lots of modem racks at the central end either.... In fact we dont have many modem lines at the moment, but there is strong pressure to provide more dialup access. Some users (research staff, lecturers..) may indeed be able to afford ISDN cards for their PCs or workstations but the 'students' and others may not. It seems silly to invest in both more analogue lines and modems on site as well as new ISDN lines and interfaces too. So, what do people think? Does anyone have code to interpret modem or TA generated traffic in software? Do you all think this is rubbish? Of course, if we accept the above, we may find us decoding modem or TA traffic, finding it contains 'SLIP' or 'PPP' and then dealing with that too..... Bye for now,.... Dave Price ------- End of Forwarded Message