[HEA] _____________________ ___ _ |___ ______________| | | | | | | _ | | | | | || | | | | | | || | | | | | | || | | | ____ _ _ _ _ ______ | | | || | | | / __ \ | | / \_/ \ | ___ \ | | | || |__ ____ | | / / \ | | /\ /\ \ | | \ \ | | | || _ \ | _ \ | | \ \__/ | | | |_|| | | |__/ / | | | || | | || |_|| | | \___/|_| |_| |_| | ____/ |_| | || | | || |__ | |____________________ | | _ |__||_| |_|\____/ |________________________| | | |_| | | Lighting Your Apple II Path On Delphi | | |_| >>> WELCOME TO THE LAMP! <<< ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ THINKING KFEST: KansasFest On The Web AND THE BEST OF THE A2 AND A2PRO MESSAGE BOARDS "Teaching the Apple II user how to fish since 1998" :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: The Lamp! An Onipa'a Software Production Vol. 1, No. 7 :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: Publisher & Editor.......................Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W. Internet Email........................................thelamp@delphi.com :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: TABLE OF CONTENTS ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ July 15, 1998 OPENING PITCH Simple, Practical, Proven -------------------------------------- [OPN] A FUNNY THING HAPPENED [FOR] The Heat Is On ------------------------------------------------- [HET] Miscellanea [MSC] Rumor Mill ----------------------------------------------------- [RMR] Public Postings [PUB] Best Of The Best ----------------------------------------------- [BOB] A2Pro_DUCTIVITY Checking out A2PRO on Delphi ----------------------------------- [A2P] THINKING KFEST KansasFest On The Web ------------------------------------------ [KFE] EXTRA INNINGS About The Lamp! ------------------------------------------------ [INN] [*] [*] [*] READING THE LAMP! The index system used by The Lamp! is designed to make """"""""""""""""" your reading easier. To use this system, load this issue into any word processor or text editor. In the index you will find something like: EXTRA INNINGS About The Lamp! ------------------------------------------------ [INN] To read this article, simply use your search or find command to locate [INN]. There is a similar tag at the end of each article: [EOA]. :: DISCUSSED ON DELPHI :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: : : : I'm not a programmer (but I am one helluva good : : tennis player) : : : ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: PSEMEL :::::::: [EOA] [OPN]------------------------------ OPENING PITCH | ----------------------------------- From The Editor """"""""""""""" by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W. [thelamp@delphi.com] SIMPLE, PRACTICAL, PROVEN ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Since our last talk, to the alternating cheers and jeers of the mainstream computing crowd, Microsoft unleashed its _Windows 98_ operating system on an expecting world. "Windows 98 Party!" cried CompUSA and Computer City and other giant computing retailing chains, making anxious buyers late for work the next morning with their after-midnight madness. Not just on the island, but across the nation if not the world, the hype that would be king of mainstream computing finally went on sale with all the hoopla of a Broadway opening--in fact, even more hoopla than that. I don't subscribe to the belief that any operating system (regardless of origin) is evil. It's just an alternative, and a new version brings with it all the advances--real and less than--that we're used to with new technology in any field. The mythical state of obsolesence is the direction such an introduction is supposedly pushing us in. But is it? Alternatives to that which is old abound, regardless of what we're talking about. For daily transportation, I drive a truck that went out of production eight years ago. I heat up my lunch at work in a microwave oven out of the early '80's, I wear a pair of shoes that I bought almost a year ago and can't find at the store anymore. By modern definitions, all of these things are obsolete, yet the truck still runs, the oven still heats, and the shoes still pass dress code. That hasn't changed. If you look for a computing example, you need not look far, indeed. In fact, I have no need to even discuss my old Apple II's--just look at my Macintosh computers, both of which are no longer in production. Yet the keyboard still types, the hard drive still spins, and the screen still lights up. It still works. As does the Apple II. In my estimation, mainstream computer equipment is not unlike mainstream athletic equipment. I went for a bicycle ride with a friend of mine, new to cycling, who showed up with a 24 speed fully suspended mountain bike to ride with me as I took my tourer, a vintage 1989 converted Bridgestone mountain bike, on one of the first mid-length rides of the summer. He certainly had nice new equipment, including a shiny new helmet, jersey, and shorts, along with his bike. Unfortunately for him, he didn't pick up any new speed along with his stuff, being just as fast as he was the month before. Newer is nice, but is it better? As long as there is a place for the new, there'll also be a place for the not-so-new. And that's where I'll be, Apple II in tow. [*] [*] [*] And Charles Barkley Is Really 6'7" Department: I had announced this month's issue of _The Lamp!_ would be shorter than usual due to the fact that KansasFest 1998 is fast approaching and I have a lot to do to get ready for my annual trip to Avila. However, as this issue nears completion, I see that in terms of actual length, this file is longer than ever. Don't give me the credit: give the credit to the A2 and A2Pro gang on Delphi, who have given the opportunity for me to carry their vital discussions here in _The Lamp!_. I'll be leaving for KFest within days. Take care. Ryan thelamp@delphi.com ASCII ART BEGINS _________ _ _ _ |__ __| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |___ ____ | | _____ __ ___ _ _ _____ | | | | | ___ \ / __ \ | | /____ \ | v v | | v ___ \ | | | | | | | | | /__\ \ | | ____| | | /\ /\ | | / \ \ | | | | | | | | | _____| | | / ___ | | || || | | | | | |_| | | | | | | | |_____ | |____ | |__| | | || || | | \___/ / _ |_| |_| |_| \______| |______| \____^_| |_||_||_| | |\____/ |_| | | | | |_| ASCII ART ENDS [EOA] [OPN]------------------------------ A FUNNY THING HAPPENED. . . . | ----------------------------------- Checking out A2 on Delphi """"""""""""""""""""""""" by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W. [thelamp@delphi.com] * The Heat Is On * Miscellanea * Rumor Mill * Public Postings * Best Of The Best THE HEAT IS ON """""""""""""" [*] Apple Operating System ....... System Software Patches [*] Hardware Hacker ....... Modems + Lightning = New Modems [*] The Apple II Legacy ....... Just Days Left 'Till KFest X [*] General Chatter ....... The Future of the Apple II [*] Vendors & Tech Support ....... Do Not Feed The Energy Creature MISCELLANEA """"""""""" SIS HTML COMPATIBILITY SIS knows how to deal with all of the HTML 3.2 """""""""""""""""""""" tags. There are several books you can find at your local book store which go in detail on the HTML 3.2 syntax. The official specifications on HTML 3.2 can be found at www.w3.org, but they don't provide useful examples which can be found in books. I would recommend that you purchase SIS so you can see how SIS actually parses the tags. Geoff (SISGEOFF, 13586, GO COM A2) THE SEARCH FOR SYSTEM 6.0.1 PATCHES This is what I found - descriptions """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" from memory - I can look them up and give you more (accurate) detail, if you like: #54 - Fix ROM Blaster - Fixes a problem where programs can be loaded across a 32K memory boundary, causing data from another program to be wiped. #57 - Desktop Memory Fixer - Fixes a problem with the Window Manager forgetting about memory it has allocated and re-allocating it when switching between graphics modes. #59 - DiskCount - CDev to make only the correct number of 5.25" drives show up in Finder. #64 - Fix Disk Mount Bug - Fixes a problem relating to disk swapping. #65 - QD Picture Patch - Patches a number of things to allow printing of large graphics - Don (IronTooth) Delivered by my ANSITerm off-line reader scripts... They're OLRight! (DZAHNISER, 13014, GO COM A2) <<<<< BTW - The only patch that I recall from GS+ was 'Dr.Bazyar', which """"" patched the High Sierra FST to recognize space characters (and some other characters) in volume, folder, and file names. According to the article, the HS.FST was correctly written, but the patch is to allow the FST to work with volumes created with other operating systems/utilities that are not adhering to the standard. - Don (IronTooth) Delivered by my ANSITerm off-line reader scripts... They're OLRight! (DZAHNISER, 13015, GO COM A2) >>>>> As the author of both FixFontMgr601 and GUPP, GUPP certainly """"" obsoletes FFM601 and my FixKern204* patch program for GNO/ME 2.0.4 and some common programs for it. GUPP is faster than the previous programs, and has one of the best patches-per-disk-block ratios around. I do not have any other Softdisk patches handled by GUPP; I've never bothered asking them to use their code. Nathan Mates (NMATES, 13019, GO COM A2) <<<<< The Magic Routing bug fix (auxtype $00000002 to be accurate) was """"" published in the Letters column of GS+ V6.N2. The letter was from Michael Guitton of France... - Don (IronTooth) Delivered by my ANSITerm off-line reader scripts... They're OLRight! (DZAHNISER, 13059, GO COM A2) >>>>> Or, park the System folder out on your desktop in the Finder, which """"" is what all the Apple guys did, and why they thought it worked fine when they released it. With that method, no need to find a filetype changer (which can be too much of a tool to shoot oneself in the foot if you're not careful) or anything else. Nathan "Magic routing is fluff anyhow" Mates (NMATES, 13062, GO COM A2) >>>>> Ok, my ignorance is going to show... what is magic routing? """"" As it's supposed to work, within the Finder, if you drag a NDA/CDA/CDEV /etc to the System folder icon and release it, the Finder will deposit files in the appropriate subdirectory. As Jeff previously noted, support for FinderExtras is sometimes flakey-- those can go in either the FinderExtras folder or the System.Setup folder, and the Finder decides for you where they should go. [Anything in FinderExtras will be loaded at Finder [re]startup, and dumped when the Finder quits or launches things; in System.Setup, they're loaded once at boot and never dumped. The SS folder method uses more ram, but can be faster if you launch lots of programs. Not everything is programmed to be dumped from ram, so do NOT place things in FE unless the dox (and filetypes-- they're not just something to overwrite at will) say so] Nathan Mates (NMATES, 13110, GO COM A2) PATCHES VERSUS ENHANCEMENTS I thought that patches to the operating """"""""""""""""""""""""""" system was -all- that Diz & Co. did! ;) GS+Vol7No1 - Dr. Bayzar - ISO 9960 & High Sierra CD-ROM patch GS+Vol6No6 - Doc Alias - What "Easy Mount" left out GS+Vol6No4 - Finder Binder - Matches Documents with their Programs GS+Vol6No3 - Cool Cursor - Is My 'GS Hung or What! GS+Vol6No3 - Ellifont - Double-Click Any Font to view its style! GS+Vol6No2 - Geeker - Edits Finder's "Geek" preferences GS+Vol5No5 - More Sound - Adds more event sounds to the system. GS+Vol5No4 - What is This? - An _expanded_ Get Info Dialog GS+Vol4No6 - Extra Bits - Controls all of those Battery RAM switches that Apple forgot to include on the control panels GS+Vol4No4 - Rainbow - color control of icons and their windows GS+Vol4No3 - Rebuild DeskTop - There IS a reason why Mac owners are - supposed to rebuild their desktop once - a month. The 'GS has rBundles too! GS+Vol3No5 - Shuffle - Shuffle up (or down) those stacked windows... GS+Vol3No5 - Whoosh - Sound, NO Sound; Tunneled Rectangles or NOT... This list goes all the way back to the system 6 announcement issue. One may argue that some of these items are not patches, per say, but add-on features. If a programmer puts a function into an operating system that is not yet fully implemented or already in the domain of an application (existing or not), and it is not necessary for the OS to have these "improvments" to run the machine, I consider it to be a "field modification" or "patch". (Ya gettin' dis Miz Reno?) Mike Brouillette; the "Un-Dead Apple" ,___(?___ / _ _\ Delivered via Spectrum v2.1 & Crock 'O Gold v2.1 \ )|(@)m(_, `~7oooood' (Thanks Ewen, Dave, Robert, Ken, Kit, Gary, et.al.!) (MBROUI11ETTE, 13033, GO COM A2) SSII RETURNS FROM VACATION It sure was nice logging onto Delphi after a 3 """""""""""""""""""""""""" week absense and reading all the kind words that people had posted about the latest issue of Shareware Solutions II. I did get back in time for the Monday night multi-system chat, and that was a fun homecoming. As I'm sure you can imagine, when I got home, my (snail-mail) mailbox was filled to the brim, and it's going to take me a while to process all the orders and mail them out. I thank you, in advance, for your patience while waiting for your disks to arrive. And thanks to Tony Diaz for handling the Bot for the past 3 weeks. Joe Kohn (JOE_KOHN, 13555, GO COM A2) NEW BINSCII BUG DETECTED For the LBR ($E0) file type, what's the """""""""""""""""""""""" difference between the auxiliary types $8002 and $8102? I mostly see the first one, but sometimes the other type is used and I can't see any pattern. Just curious... Michael (SAR, 13416, GO COM A2) >>>>> $8102 is not listed in the Technical Notes that I have... """"" Perhaps the File Type Librarian can give us the answer. Ewen Wannop - Speccie Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5! Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/ (EWANNOP, 13426, GO COM A2) >>>>> I dimly recall that $8102 was the result of a bug in a BinSCII """"" encoder. -- Steve Reeves (REEVESST, 13456, GO COM A2) >>>>> As far as I know, $8102 is not a valid auxtype for LBR ($E0) files """"" (it's not listed in the filetype notes.) I do remember seeing it somewhere, but I can't remember where or what program created it. If anyone has one of these files, let us know what it is. If it's just a regular Shrinkit archive then it simply has an incorrect auxtype (which program created it?) ----------------------------------------------------- Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5] -- Pardon me, but your shoe is ringing... (TONYW1, 13504, GO COM A2) >>>>> I verified that its the GScii+ v2.3.1 encoder that has the bug that """"" produces the bogus $8102 auxtype. -- Steve Reeves (REEVESST, 13535, GO COM A2) >>>>> You mean when it extracts a ShrinkIt archive it gives it $8102 """"" instead of $8002? Shame, shame. :) Anyway, it won't hurt anything if you change all the $8102 archives to $8002, as long as they really are ShrinkIt archives. ----------------------------------------------------- Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5] -- Today's subliminal message is . (TONYW1, 13539, GO COM A2) >>>>> No, I mean when it creates the BinSCII file, it puts the auxtype """"" $8102 into the BinSCII file instead of $8002. So any program that decodes that file will give it $8102. (With the exception of David Empson's descii, which is smart enough to correct this as a special case.) -- Steve Reeves (REEVESST, 13540, GO COM A2) >>>>> That is bad... GScii should not be changing the file or aux types """"" at all. Does it change the aux type of any other file, it could make a real mess of things if it did? If you are using Spectrum, then you should discard all the GScii and BinSCII apps, and use the BinHQX XCMD instead... Ewen Wannop - Speccie Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5! Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/ (EWANNOP, 13573, GO COM A2) >>>>> The bug appears to be a rounding error when extracting the high """"" byte of the auxtype. If so, then any auxtype greater than $8000 that doesn't end in 00 would be affected. -- Steve Reeves (REEVESST, 13619, GO COM A2) >>>>> Thanks for your legwork in sorting this matter out. I'll go through """"" and try to fix as many of the mistyped archives that I can find. (Just what I need, more work!) And see about finding a solid replacement for GScii, finally. Michael (SAR, 13596, GO COM A2) >>>>> The latest BinHQX XCMD for Spectrum is available free from the """"" library here on Delphi, and supports BinSCII, BinHex 4.0, UUencode and full MIME Base 64. You do need Spectrum 2.1 to use it of course... Ewen Wannop - Speccie Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5! Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/ (EWANNOP, 13603, GO COM A2) RAMFAST AND REALLY LARGE HARD DRIVES I had a friend ask me what was the """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" largest size hard drive that could be handled by a GS running GS/OS and a RamFAST. Since I use a //e, I didn't have a clue, but told them I'd find out. I _think_ I've heard of people with 1 gig drives hooked to their RamFAST card, but what about larger units, and to what limits? Thanks! Later..............Howard (HKATZ, 13687, GO COM A2) >>>>> The RamFAST SCSI allows you twelve partitions per drive, and twelve """"" active partitions on the SCSI chain, and up to eight SCSI devices on the chain. Now, to address your question directly, are we talking -theory- or actuality? In actuality, I have used a 1 gig drive on a RamFAST (11 32 meg ProDOS partitions and one 666 meg HFS partition named "Hades"). It's the biggest SCSI drive I've had come through here (although if I can scratch up enough for that nine gig drive I've had my eye on for months, we can test theory a little :) In theory, you can go far past one gig. You can have twelve partitions per drive. I think the maximum size that GS/OS allows per volume is 4 gigs and the max size that HFS allows is 2 gigs (Geeks jump in here--at 7 am I don't have references ready :). If that's the case, you could have 28 gigs on a hard drive per GS/OS but only 14 gigs because of the HFS limitations. You couldn't -boot- from such a drive as there's no ProDOS partition, and I can't imagine partitioning a drive this way as you have little chance of recovering a file on a HFS partition gone south, but we're talking theory, right? Would the RamFAST choke on such a drive? Certainly, it's possible, but I also don't have a 28 gig drive to check it out on. In actuality, be assured that I have personally used a 1 gig drive on a RamFAST. If/when I get larger ones that work its way through here, I'll check them out. Ryan KFest '98! Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm (RSUENAGA, 13712, GO COM A2) IIGS COMPRESSION UTILITIES REVISITED Time to kick the hornet's nest. :) """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" Okay, so with the newly-uploaded compression utility, Hard Pressed, I find that I now have a choice between it and my old standby, AutoArk. AutoArk has worked nearly flawlessly for me since I purchased it some time ago, but I find myself wondering if perhaps I should give HP a fair chance to impress me enough to switch over to it instead... yes, that will take awhile to do, but if HP is a better program, I'm willing to do it. That said, I should mention that I don't compress active program files. So far I've only used it to compress text files and unused program files, to save HD space. So, for someone like me, is it worth switching over? :) If anyone has used both, and would like to share war stories or just personal experiences that led to choosing one over the other, I'd love to hear them. I'm not trying to hurt feelings or start a "mine is better than yours" kind of debate, please. Let's try to be kind. :) Thank You. Hugs, Goldfische Conference Manager, New Age Forum (go rel new) Web: { Newage} Reduce, Reuse, Recycle, Renew ... The Earth Belongs To Our Children Sent by Spectrum 2.1 & COG 2.3 for the AppleIIGS --- Viva la Text! (GOLDFISCHE, 13433, GO COM A2) >>>>> I once tried a disk compression utility, and quickly decided it was """"" safer and faster if I did not use it. Most disk utilities will not help you when you get a problem... With the PC using more and more SCSI drives, the price of hard drives is dropping through the floor. The need for a compression utility is no longer what it was. Here in the UK it is now very difficult to get hold of drives as small as 2Gb. The commonest starter size is now 4Gb at around $200. This means that your friendly Mac dealer is going to be awash with left over 500Mb-2Gb drives from Mac owners who have upgraded... Ewen Wannop - Speccie Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5! Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/ (EWANNOP, 13440, GO COM A2) >>>>> Keep in mind, though, that a file-based compression utility (like """"" HardPressed or AutoArk) is much safer than a disk-based compression utility like you tend to see on the PC. Compressed disks can get into a state where the entire disk becomes useless. But compressed files are just... files. You should be able to unpack them one by one if you need to, if an emergency arises and you have to turn off the compression software. Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum (SHEPPY, 13443, GO COM A2) >>>>> Well, I've used both of those and I liked HardPressed much better """"" HardPressed is lots faster than AutoArk and it works somewhat different; the biggest advantage of HardPressed is, you can tell it the names of folders and every item in that folder is automatically compressed or decompressed when you need it. HardPressed leaves the icons alone so even a compressed file has the "original" Icon HardPressed works transparently, so you don't even notice it doing its work. In the end I had all five partitions of my IIGS HD compressed (except the System folder, although there are items which can be compressed, too, in the System folder) and it worked flawlessly from day one. Even the images for Bernie are compressed by HardPressed, as I just made the real ProDOS HD into images as they were. BTW, if you read this Henrik, HDT 2.0.5 has no ProDOS support any more! I had to downgrade to 1.8.x for getting the ProDOS HD recognized. It was impossible with 2.0.5 to install a Mac driver on that HD. Udo Ceterum censeo, Microsoft esse delendam (UDOHUTH, 13488, GO COM A2) INTREC ON MODEMS AND CABLES """"""""""""""""""""""""""" > ...if you're looking for a highspeed modem, try this one. It's dirt > cheap... > Anybody figured out how to get it to download using ProTerm? Let's analyse that: A really cheapo modem, what's wrong with ProTERM ?? :| The easiest way for major modem (and any appliance device) manufacturers to develop sales in other markets, is to take the guts of their popular device, inhibit the feature-functions slightly, change the package, and sell at a low-ball price under a pseudonym and psuedomodel. All they've done is to make the device less attractive, less usable, and low-cost availability. This allows them to manufacture the entire line, even the quality model at a much lower cost, and to also sell the quality product at a much higher profit, and the inhibited model at a cheap price that will move large quantities. A similar strategy has always been common in the auto industry where there are many common parts for Cad, Pontiac, Chev such as glass, trim, roller, hinge, closure parts, et al. Parts is parts! :) Large appliance/goods stores, Sears, Wards, etc., put a twist on this strategy. They do not sell the cheap model, but privately refer to these (inhibited) models as "bolt-downs" because they're the ones advertised but never sold (they are in essence, bolted to the floor - thus the name). They are advertised cheap, the customer comes to buy one and the salesperson, under pressure of losing their job, makes sure the bolt-down, is =never= sold, but those with the bells and whistles (and profit margin) move out of the warehouse at a good clip. The lowly bolt-down, most probably the only one in stock, remains until it dies of obsolescence. However, large quantities of the "bolt-down" are moved through those schlocky horrid ads on radio, TV and newspaper from stores that hawk the cheap stuff. I bought a brand name TV cheap, at a schlock store. Later to find that if I would have shopped, I could have had the same brand, different model at a slightly higher price, that model had features I would have enjoyed using and would have paid the difference to get. I then came to realize what I already knew -- I had purchased a bolt-down -- some of us are slow learners :) Another lesson is later learned, what do I do if I have a problem or a question? The store I bought my TV from couldn't/wouldn't help, and later closed their doors. The credited stores (Sears, Wards etc) have excellent return, guarantee and repair facilities for their appliances but we are lucky to find anyone that will talk to us if we happen to buy the bolt-down from the price vendors. That being said: > Anybody figured out how to get it to download using ProTerm? Another Delphi user asked about this modem and ProTERM, and Greg Schaefer offered this: ...tack on an E0 to the end of [the init string] (ProTERM requires that modem echo be disabled). ...boot directly into ProDOS8 to make sure there is no GS/OS stuff running which might cause data loss [and try it again]. Booting directly into ProDOS 8 apparently resolved the problem for her. Anything stealing clock cyles can play havoc with download protocol timing. Regards, AutoReply: Jerry Cline @ InTrec Software, Inc. - jerry@intrec.com ProTERM @ your service! The superior telnet and dialup application. Sent w/ProTERM Message Manager (PTMM) - Details @ Download ProTERM & PTMM the full working versions: (INTREC, 13179, GO COM A2) <<<<< A point of clarity here. """"" While it is true that all cables are not created equal, if the cable is designed for use on a Mac, is sold with a quality product of a recognized brand, and is a hand-shake design (if it sells with a modem faster than 9600, it better be), the chances of the cable being correctly wired are very high. On the other hand if the cable is sold with a cheap off brand, modem, who knows unless there is a pinout (schematic) of the available. Customers have sent cables to us in their modes of frustration, and some have been wired for who knows for what -- we have no clue?? In those cases, our modem cable easily resolved the problem. The common cable problem is when cable "looks" right, but is not checked. Until recently, there were many more printers than modems, and the chance of getting a printer cable was high. Printers are terminal devices (the signal stops there) and modems are not (they pass the signal through). Consequently, the send and receive pins are reversed on a printer cable because when the printer needs to communicate with the CPU, it sends a signal via the send pin to the receive pin on the CPU, and the CPU sends to its send pin which is received by the printer's receive pin. As it relates to Spectrum, I assume they still advocate the design from the ProTERM manual that Greg Schaefer designed. I say this because several years ago, Seven Hills verbally requested permission to also advocate that same design, and we gave that permission. I think the person who called was Dave? I'm sure they would agree with what I stated above. One of the great attributes of the cable design we use is, it is completely universal from 300 baud to whatever bps it is pressed it to meet. Regards, AutoReply: Jerry Cline @ InTrec Software, Inc. - jerry@intrec.com ProTERM @ your service! The superior telnet and dialup application. Sent w/ProTERM Message Manager (PTMM) - Details @ Download ProTERM & PTMM the full working versions: (INTREC, 13180, GO COM A2) STAN, GARY, AND RYAN AND THE RAMFAST REVISION B ODYSSEY I posted this on """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" Genie, also, but just to make sure I get a good sampling of sage advice, I'm putting it here, too. :) A friend of mine recently gave me RamFast rev. B SCSI card. I currently have it installed in a "spare" GS that I'm putting together. I hooked up a little NCS SCSI drive that I have so I could check the card out, but instead of booting up, it returns the "Unable to locate ProDOS" message. (The first partition on this drive =does= have a bootable system setup and boots just fine on my main GS, BTW.) I =believe= I had everything configured correctly in the RamFast Utilities when I booted it up the first time, but now I can't seem to get back into the utility screen to check the configuration. :/ My questions are: 1) How do I get back to the Utilities screen to check the configuration? I tried holding down the "8" key while booting (which works with my RamFast rev. D card on my GS at school), but that doesn't work. 2) Is there anything else that might cause that error message that I am perhaps overlooking? This friend says that the RamFast worked fine the last time he used it, but that was several years ago. Any ideas, suggestions, or random thoughts will be appreciated. :) Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.5 and COG KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13138, GO COM A2) >>>>> I've always used numeric-keypad-0, and that's worked on my Rev C """"" and Rev D (ROM versions 3.0something thru 3.01f). 8 is the key to ProDOS-8 boot in an unmodified System 6.x. Nathan Mates (NMATES, 13139, GO COM A2) <<<<< Uhm...heheh...I knew that! :} """"" Unfortunately, the 0 key doesn't seem to work, either Nathan, BUT... changing the RamFast to another slot screws up it's configuration and =forces= it to boot into the RamFast Utilities. Ryan and Tony were "helping" me with this last night in the A2 conference, and that's how I discovered that I could force the RamFast into the Utilities screen, but when I finally did get there, it seems that there is NO TransWarp option, and there IS a "Slot Allocation Priority" setting, both of which Ryan thinks indicate an old set of ROM chips begging for an upgrade. Just to clarify the problem, I presently have the RamFast card installed in Slot 7 of a "spare" ROM 3 GS with a 4-meg memory card. (I also tried it in a ROM 01 with the same memory card and got the same results.) I have an NCS HD that is my secondary drive on my main GS and which is connected to an Apple High Speed SCSI card. This drive has 2 partitions: NCS.1 (ProDOS, 32 Mb) and NCS.2 (HFS, 129.5 Mb). The first partition has a full system 6.0.1 installed and will boot up just fine on my main GS...the "fun" begins when I hook it up to the RamFast on the other computer. When the drive is connected to the RamFast on the other machine, it appears to operate normally but returns the "Unable to locate ProDOS" message...and yet, ProDOS IS there on the drive, and yes, the slot assignments are correctly set in the Control Panels (S7-Your Card). (Remember...I said it boots just fine on my main machine with the AHS card? :) Any attempts to bring up the RamFast Utilities from the ROMDisk (rebooting with the 0 key) to check the configuration is futile, but, again, I CAN force it by moving the card to another slot. Even doing so and re-configuring the card (and reassigning the startup to S6-Your Card) yields the same error message. So... I then tried putting my Focus card in with the RamFast and booting with it. The Focus boots up just fine, the CVTECH.ROM shows up on the screen, and the RamFast recognizes NCS.1 but NOT NCS.2! If I try to run the RamFast Utilities from either the ROMDisk or NCS.1, it asks me to "insert the disk NCS.2"! Pressing Return yields the same request, so I have to Escape to get out of the utilities. If I try to run the utilities from the Focus drive, the computer crashes, and I'm back to square one! :/ So, after "sleeping on it", the following conclusions occur to me: 1) The RamFast IS working, but maybe it doesn't recognize the ProDOS on the NCS.1 partition OR the #2 HFS partition (yet it DOES recognize a 27 Mb HFS partition on the Focus), which leads me to believe that... 2) The RamFast ROMs need to be replaced with Rev.C ROMs. Does that sound reasonable/plausible/possible? Any other ideas or suggestions? Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5 KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13159, GO COM A2) >>>>> When you get into the utilities screen you should see, in the upper """"" left quadrant of that screen, a few lines of text that give you, among other things, the ROM revision of the RF utilities. If you don't, you have a REALLY REALLY old Rev B card. :) Gary R. Utter (UTTER, 13181, GO COM A2) <<<<< Well, I have a REALLY REALLY old Rev. B card, then. """"" Actually, Ryan pointed that out to me the other night...so, now the question is, "What does that mean?" Is the card usable as is or should I (can I, even?) upgrade the ROMs? As per Ryan's instructions, I called Sequential yesterday and told them that I had a Rev.C card (yes, that's what Ryan told me to tell them :) and needed the upgraded ROMs, U15 & U16, for it. They wanted me to send the card to them, insisting I could not perform the upgrade myself. They also wanted $45 to do the upgrade, but what they were talking about was upgrading a Rev.C to a Rev.D card. I finally had to tell them that I actually had a Rev.B card and just wanted to upgrade it to Rev.C. They said that they didn't even know if they could do that, but if I wanted to send it in that they would try it - no promises. I told them I would get back to them. :) So...what - if anything - can I do with this thing? Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5 KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13186, GO COM A2) >>>>> The card is not really usable as is. The ROM has some seriously """"" nasty bugs. However, I am currently running RamFast #0022, which is to say, I KNOW that your card can be brought up to current standards. You need the current revision of U15 and U16, and you need to make sure that your DRAM is up to snuff. If it is Samsung, replace it. Period. There were SOME Rev Bs that went out with a midly defective oscillator crystal, but not all of them. Probably a good idea to replace it just to be on the safe side. I'm not sure what the specs are for the replacement, but one of the tech types should be able to tell you. (It's a simple soldering job.) If it comes down to that, I have some fairly recent ROM chips here. I'm not sure HOW recent, but they are a lot better than what you have. :) Gary R. Utter (UTTER, 13188, GO COM A2) >>>>> Gary's info in message 13188 is very, very to the point and much """"" more direct than the following post, however, it might be helpful for trivia fans. . . >> If you don't, you have a REALLY REALLY old Rev B card. :) > Well, I have a REALLY REALLY old Rev. B card, then. > Actually, Ryan pointed that out to me the other night...so, now the > question is, "What does that mean?" Is the card usable as is or should > I (can I, even?) upgrade the ROMs? It means you need to do something about it ("something" detailed below) for it to be usable; no, it's not usable as is really; and yes you should and yes you can upgrade the ROMs. > As per Ryan's instructions, I called Sequential yesterday and told them > that I had a Rev.C card (yes, that's what Ryan told me to tell them :) Yes, that's exactly what I said to tell them, for reasons explained in detail below. . . > and needed the upgraded ROMs, U15 & U16, for it. They wanted me to send > the card to them, insisting I could not perform the upgrade myself. They're wrong :) > They also wanted $45 to do the upgrade, but what they were talking about > was upgrading a Rev.C to a Rev.D card. I finally had to tell them that I > actually had a Rev.B card and just wanted to upgrade it to Rev.C. They > said that they didn't even know if they could do that, but if I wanted > to send it in that they would try it - no promises. I told them I would > get back to them. :) Okay; here's a bit of history, and a bit of explanation. . . When we discuss "RamFAST Revisions" there are two different things we could be talking about: 1) The board revision and 2) The ROM revision There are three distinct RamFAST board revisions (aka card revisions) out there: the Rev. B, Rev. C, and Rev. D (intentionally ignoring the special //e compatible Rev. D card which I've never seen, and the Rev. A which never made public distribution). The Rev. B and Rev. C cards are practically identical, and, in fact, are almost indistinguishable unless the person trying to tell the difference really knows what to look for. In fact, they use =the same ROMs= (more later on the significance of this, besides what is blatantly obvious). They are usable with the //e and IIgs, are large cards with dip switches, and can't easily be upgraded beyond 256k of cache (they can be upgraded, just not easily by mere mortals). The Rev. D card is a distinctly different beastie which is IIgs compatible only, eliminated the DIP switches in favor of a single jumper and the RamFAST util program, and only uses a single replacable ROM chip instead of the 2 that the Rev. B/C cards use. Now, old timers know that Sequential is not the originator of the RamFAST; it was born via CVTech, which sold the rights to it and the 8 meg IIgs card that Sequential currently sells to Sequential. When Sequential took over support of the RamFAST, for some reason, it totally stopped supporting Rev. B cards, and really, they don't know anything whatsoever about it. However, as you see above, the Rev. C card, which it still supports, is functionally identical, so. . . simply order the Rev. C ROMs, and replace the ROMs currently in the Rev. B with them. The older (I would guess pre-3.00 but I'm not 100% sure) versions of the RamFAST ROMs couldn't do anything with partitions larger than 32 megs (okay, maybe CD ROMs were a special case, but I didn't have a CD Rom drive in those days :), which is why the HFS partition that Stan is unable to mount is not recognized (really, those were pre System 6, pre-HFS.FST days, so greater than 32 meg partitions were not an issue). So, what you need to do is upgrade the ROMs in the Rev. B RamFAST by using the current 3.01f versions of the Rev. C ROMs. Technically, this is not the same as going to a Rev. C from a Rev. B; it's merely upgrading the ROM, not the card, and Sequential will get confused (as you can see) when you say anything bout a Rev. B card. Just tell them you want the Rev. C ROMs. And, if you're wondering how I know all of this, it's because I have a Rev. B RamFAST right here in the GS that's posting this message, with Rev. 3.01f ROMs for the Rev. C RamFAST in them, and the thing works like an absolute champ. :) > So...what - if anything - can I do with this thing? Well, you can give it to me. . . :) Ryan KFest '98! Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm (RSUENAGA, 13189, GO COM A2) <<<<< In message 'RE: RamFast rev.B problem (Re: Msg 13186)' UTTER said: """"" > You need the current revision of U15 and U16, and you need to make sure > that your DRAM is up to snuff. If it is Samsung, replace it. Period. Yeah, Ryan said something about that the other night. Looking at the card, I don't =see= any chips with "Samsung" on them, but there are several with a stylized S or ST. Are either of those Samsung? > There were SOME Rev Bs that went out with a midly defective oscillator > crystal, but not all of them. Probably a good idea to replace it just to > be on the safe side. Where would I find the oscillator chip? > If it comes down to that, I have some fairly recent ROM chips here. I'm > not sure HOW recent, but they are a lot better than what you have. :) Thanks, Gary...I'll keep that in mind. :) Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5 KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13190, GO COM A2) >>>>> Electronically speaking, the Rev B and the Rev C are TOTALLY """"" identical. The first production run (for public sale) of the RamFast was the Rev B card. After the first 200 boards were made, a minor design error was discovered. This error was fixed by installing 1 or 2 jumper wires on the card (I forget how many). The Rev C card is simply a Rev B card with those jumper wires traced right into the card. The ONLY change in the Rev C is that the two jumpers were made into traces and the Rev level of the card was changed from B to C. Gary R. Utter (UTTER, 13196, GO COM A2) >>>>> "I don't =see= any chips with "Samsung" on them, but there are """"" several with a stylized S or ST. Are either of those Samsung?" Might be. There is a bank of 8 DRAM chips on there, just like on a memory card. Those are the ones that you need to be concerned about. You can replace them with stock GS DRAM chips. Given the current price of those chips, I'd probably replace them just for luck. (When that card was made, those chips were close to $100. :) >> "Where would I find the oscillator chip?" It's not a chip, it's a little metal "can". There is a crystal inside it, it looks like a crystal from an old scanner or CB radio, if you have ever seen one of those. Oh, and when I said "fairly recent", the chips I was referring to are at LEAST 4 years old, probably more. :) Gary R. Utter (UTTER, 13197, GO COM A2) <<<<< OK...if you're talking about the cache memory chips, those appear """"" to be the same as on the old AE GS-RAM card I got (from the same friend ). They have a stylized M inside a circle (just guessing, here - Motorola?) and some of the numbers on the chips are the same as on the ones on the GS-RAM card. >>>"Where would I find the oscillator chip?" > It's not a chip, it's a little metal "can". Yeah, I knew that. :) What I meant was, where could I =buy= the oscillator, if I need to? > Oh, and when I said "fairly recent", the chips I was referring to are at > LEAST 4 years old, probably more. :) Well, I'd bet that this particular card is probably much older than that. :) I was looking at csa2m today, and Steve Buggie had a post there in which he stated that he has the upgrade ROM chip for the Rev.B card for $3. He specifically used the word "chip" and not the plural "chips", and that got me to wondering which is correct - one chip or two? (Of course, he coulda meant to type "chips".) Anyway, I emailed him to ask about them. BTW, Gary, do you know of any other sources of those upgrade ROMs besides Sequential? Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5 KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13199, GO COM A2) >>>>> "What I meant was, where could I =buy= the oscillator, if I need """"" to?" Any reasonable electonics store (meaning "NOT Radio Shack") ought to have these; if not, you can try mail order to such places as JDR, Jameco, Mouser, or any of a whole bunch of different places. . . > I was looking at csa2m today, and Steve Buggie had a post there in which > he stated that he has the upgrade ROM chip for the Rev.B card for $3. He > specifically used the word "chip" and not the plural "chips", and that > got me to wondering which is correct - one chip or two? (Of course, he > coulda meant to type "chips".) Anyway, I emailed him to ask about them. I'll bet you a SSII subscription extension that what is being sold is a different beastie. Here's another Apple II history thing for ya. . . Apple Computer, Inc. sold two different SCSI cards for the Apple II: The Apple II SCSI and the Apple II High Speed SCSI. The Apple II SCSI went through three different ROM revisions: Rev. A, Rev. B, and Rev. C. Anything pre-Rev. C is just asking for problems (nasty bugs including stuff like formatting a volume when trying to eject a 3.5 inch disk) and in fact, GS/OS just plain won't run on a pre Rev. C card. The upgrade to that is a single chip. It is merely coincidence that there is a Rev. C Apple SCSI card (as well as a Rev. B) and a Rev. C RamFAST SCSI card (as well as a Rev. B and Rev. D). > BTW, Gary, do you know of any other sources of those upgrade ROMs > besides Sequential? Unless Alltech has them, the only place that I knew that carried them was LRO (aka Other World Computing), and I'd prefer to order from Sequential to them. . . Ryan KFest '98! Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm (RSUENAGA, 13210, GO COM A2) >>>>> "?They have a stylized M inside a circle (just guessing, here - """"" Motorola?)" I think so, yeah. Definitely not Samsung. >> "where could I =buy= the oscillator, if I need to?" Lotsa places, it's a pretty standard part, the problem is to learn just what you need for a replacement (and whether you need it at all). >> "He specifically used the word "chip" and not the plural "chips", and >> that got me to wondering which is correct - one chip or two? " YOU need both chips, U15 and U16. _One_ of them didn't need to be revised after something like v2.1, but whatever you have is a LOT older than that. (DO NOT attempt a 1 chip upgrade with that card, do not put in the 1 chip and just try it out. You WILL regret it. Trust me. :) >> "...do you know of any other sources of those upgrade ROMs besides >> Sequential?" Certainly not a legal source, and for that matter, I don't know of an illegal one either. By the way, with regard to Ryan's comment that you NEED to update those ROMs, he is absolutely right. Your current ROMs have some serious bugs that will, sooner or later, trash large quantities of your data. I was a beta tester on those things. I know. Gary R. Utter (UTTER, 13227, GO COM A2) <<<<< OK...I just got off the phone with Sequential (who says Florence is """"" the Wicked Witch of the West?? ;), and here's what they told me: The EPROM chip is (according to Florence) the one I need to upgrade my RAMFast to v3.01f. When I asked about the U15 and U16 chips, she said that those were soldered into the board and I would have to send it to them for replacement. When I told her that the chips on MY board were socketed chips, she had no idea what I was talking about unless I had, perhaps, one of the very first Rev. C boards. (I didn't tell her otherwise. :) BTW, I was looking in the computer that this card was in when I got it and there, lying in the bottom of the case, was a small label with "U16 v1.0" hand-printed on it. :) So, anyway...now what do I do? Should I call them back and see if they even have the old U15 & U16 chips? Should I order the EPROM chip, too? Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5 KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13241, GO COM A2) >>>>> Special for you Stan, I just pulled my Rev. B RamFAST. I don't """"" like to do that because the GS with the RamFAST Rev. B I have here is in an incredibly inconvenient place to deal with, but -special for you- I pulled it (i.e. you're buying the beer at KFest '98). The stickers on the two chips in question are as follows: U15: Sequential Systems copyright (c) 1995 rev. U15CRF301-F U16: Sequential Systems copyright (c) 1995 rev. U16-2.01 > OK...I just got off the phone with Sequential (who says Florence is the > Wicked Witch of the West?? ;), and here's what they told me: > The EPROM chip is (according to Florence) the one I need to upgrade my > RAMFast to v3.01f. When I asked about the U15 and U16 chips, she said > that those were soldered into the board and I would have to send it to > them for replacement. When I told her that the chips on MY board were > socketed chips, she had no idea what I was talking about unless I had, > perhaps, one of the very first Rev. C boards. (I didn't tell her > otherwise. :) Argh. . . . > BTW, I was looking in the computer that this card was in when I got it > and there, lying in the bottom of the case, was a small label with "U16 > v1.0" hand-printed on it. :) > So, anyway...now what do I do? Should I call them back and see if they > even have the old U15 & U16 chips? Should I order the EPROM chip, too? Okay; first, some clarification: both U15 and U16 are ROMs, PROMs, EPROMs (not EEPROMs, though, I don't think, although they certainly could be :) These acronyms, assuming everyone understands ROM is Read Only Memory, mean: PROM = Programmable ROM EPROM = Erasable Programmable ROM EEPROM = Electically Erasable Programmable ROM In any case, the U15 is a 27C256 EPROM, and the U16 is a 2764A-2 EPROM. From what Florence said to you above, it clearly sounds to me like she still thinks you have a Rev. D RamFAST. What you need to order, exactly, are the ROM upgrade chips (call them ROMs, PROMs, EPROMs, whatever :) for the Rev. C RamFAST, specifically the U15 and U16, which are the only ROM chips on the board. I find it appalling, but not surprising, that Sequential is having such a difficult time with this. If need be, I can see if I can find the receipt from the last time I ordered these things from them, but if they can't already tell exactly what you need from your description, I'll be stunned if the part number would help. . . Ryan Proud owner of RamFAST Rev. B # 0128 KFest '98! Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm (RSUENAGA, 13248, GO COM A2) <<<<< Well, it appears that the RAMFast rev.B ROM upgrade dilemma is """"" finally solved! I called Sequential this morning, talked to Joe M. (Florence wasn't there ;), explained the situation thoroughly, and it was, like: "Oh! THOSE ROM chips! OK...no big deal, we have those in stock and can ship them right out to you!" Geez... Thanks, Ryan and Gary! Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5 KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13267, GO COM A2) RUMOR MILL """""""""" SIMCITY FOR THE IIGS--FANTASY AND FACT It doesn't exist; the GS version """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" of SimCity was started by Bill Heineman, but Maxis wanted $100,000 for the rights to release the game, so work was stopped with the game only about 20% done (Burger will tell you it's 80% done, but that's the way he is :). Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum (SHEPPY, 13549, GO COM A2) TRACKING THE RARE JOKO ON VACATION BY THE WOOFSTER Important message to """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" all friends of Joe Kohn... The Meister is still alive! He has been sighted near Bejing in a yurt with a hot dog. (spell it: h o t d o g) :-) Henrik Woof Gudat delivered by Bernie 1.3 CerealPuffs/MuesliPump (GUDATH, 13300, GO COM A2) RANDOM REFLECTIONS ON REALITY AND THE APPLE II I'm tempted to say here """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" here to your six points, but I got in trouble last time I did that, so I'll just say that I agree. But the bottom line is that the Apple II is coming to (has gone past?) a turning point, where every user needs to look at their Apple II and seriously consider why they still have it. If it is because you have a soft spot in your heart for it, either because you grew up with, or you think it is a thing of beauty, then the last thing you'd want to do is change it or upgrade it. You want the Apple II as it is. If it is because you cannot afford something better, and let's not pick bones here, the Mac and W95 *ARE* better in many ways, most significantly speed. You can argue the importance of proportional scroll bars and the supposed elegance of GS/OS all you like, but these other machine do more, faster. If it because you can't afford anything better, then upgrading the Apple II is not going to help, because you still wouldn't be able to afford it. And trust me, the costs WOULD be more expensive than a new Mac or PC. So seriously, I cannot see any reason to upgrade it. And if there was a reason, there's always the emulator market. But then it gets down to whether an emulator is supposed to emulate the past as a way to preserve what once was, or whether it is a way forward. Again, it may be better to just buy a Mac or PC for the heavy duty work, and keep the II for fun. Regards, Richard (RICHARD_B, 13431, GO COM A2) >>>>> I just wanted to comment on some of the ideas and comments in this """"" thread. We are working our bottoms off to offer a reliable emulation software and, once we got there, upgrade path. The future of Apple II emulation and Apple IIgs emulation in particular is to combine Apple II functionality with features offered by the hosting machine. This is IMO the only cost-effective way to push the Apple II platform ahead. It doesn't involve asking anyone for permission, it doesn't stop anyone from implementing fun features, it costs you a measly $25, and it won't stop Apple II computing to change for the better. And if it were Gus that saved the emulation world, that would free me from working on Bernie and I had a lot more spare time. Fine with me! :) As Richard suggested, the fun starts when adding features that go beyond a stock IIgs. woof, - henrik (GUDATH, 13494, GO COM A2) PUBLIC POSTINGS """"""""""""""" JUST DAYS REMAINING!!! """""""""""""""""""""" ______ _____ ( ) ( ) ____________________________________________ | | / / ( _____________________________'98____) | | / / | | | |/ / | | II Infinitum!! | / | |______ | |\ \ | _______) __________ _________ ________ | | \ \ | | ( _____) ( ___) (__ __) | | \ \ | | | |__ \ \ | | | | \ \ | | | __) \ \ | | | | \ \ | | | |_____ ___\ \ | | (______) (________) (_______) (__________) (_________) |___| MORE NEWS ON KANSASFEST 1998! KansasFest 1998 will be held once again on the campus of Avila College in Kansas City, Missouri. It will take place from July 22 - July 26, 1998. The cost of attending KFest '98 is only $365, which -includes- the use of a double room in the Avila College dorms -and- meals! There are also a limited number of single rooms available for $465. (If you wish to stay at one of the many hotels or motels near the college then the cost is $265, but you would, of course, have to find and pay for your own room and meals.) Confirmed speakers for this year include Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd (Wolfenstein 3D for the Apple IIgs), Nathan Mates (Twilight II 2.0), Tony Diaz (Alltech Electronics), Ewen Wannop (Spectrum), Geoff Weiss (Spectrum Internet Suite), Mike Westerfield (ByteWorks) and Joe Kohn (Shareware Solutions II). This year, we are running a number of contests, including the Roger Wagner tie contest, a Door Sign contest, and, for all of you programmers, we are also planning our first Hack Contest! Rules are still pending, but stay tuned for details. It's -highly- suggested anyone interested in these contests (and possible prizes) tune into the KFest Information Mailing List (see how to subscribe below). Check-in will be on Wednesday from 1-4 pm, and check-out from 11 am - 1 pm on Sunday. Computer sessions will be conducted on Thursday and Friday. A vendor fair and software and hardware demos are scheduled for Saturday. To get KFest info by email, subscribe to the KansasFest Information Mailing List. Send email to majordomo@trenco.gno.org. In the BODY of the message, place the following text: subscribe kfest You will receive a confirmation email. In order to be signed up for the list, you will have to respond to this confirmation as the instructions dictate. You will then be sent a welcome message, including instructions on how to send mail to the list. If you have other questions about KFest, or wish to make suggestions, you can find answers via the InterNet. Just send an email message to kfest@intrec.com or kfest-help@trenco.gno.org, or visit the World Wide Web page at http://www.primenet.com/~adams/kfest.html Here's hoping to see all of you in Kansas City in July! (RSUENAGA, 13225, GO COM A2) WOLFENSTEIN 3D SHOOTOUT AT KFEST OK, Kfest-ers...it's time to "Get """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" Psyched"!! Announcing the KFest Wolfenstein 3D Shootout! Do you spend much of your free time roaming the halls of Castle Wolfenstein, laying waste to Nazis and their Mutant Minions? Think you're pretty hot? Well, here's your chance to prove it! This year, I thought it would be an interesting "diversion" to have a contest featuring the latest and greatest game for the GS to come along in years...the long-awaited, much-anticipated Wolfenstein 3D! If you would like to find out just how good you are, here are the (tentative) rules: 1. One or more accelerated GS's (mine will be available) will be set up for players to use. (If someone would like to volunteer a Power Mac with Bernie and Wolf 3D on it, that might be nice, also. :) An "anonymous" scenario of not more than 10 levels will be chosen for the contest. 2. Players will proceed to play this scenario from scratch (basic weapons/ammo configuration) and with NO CHEAT CODES! The game will open with the default screen size (#4), but contestants may adjust the screen size to suit individual preferences. 3. Players may NOT save their games at each level! If you get "killed", you must start that level over from scratch. (However, if it becomes necessary for a player to interrupt the game, for some reason, it will be permissable to save the game to resume at a later time.) 4. When the game is completed (when the victory banner is displayed), players will record their final scores on the provided scoresheet. 5. The winner will be determined by the highest final score. In the event of a tie, contestants will play a tie-breaker round of one level chosen by a "referee". I think that this will give us a pretty level playing field for the contest. Anyone having other ideas or suggestions for the Wolf 3D Shootout is welcome to post them. :) Stan Marks stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5 KFest '98 Bound! (STANMARKS, 13577, GO COM A2) GSOFT CALLS ALL BETA TESTERS """""""""""""""""""""""""""" Beta Test Announcement ---------------------- The Byte Works, Inc. is looking for a small number of dedicated beta testers for a new Apple IIGS programming language. After carefully reading the specifics, if youre interested, please contact Mike Westerfield by e-mail at MikeW50@AOL.COM, sending the completed form at the end of this announcement. The Program ----------- The program is GSoft BASIC, an interpreted BASIC for the Apple IIGS. It supports many advanced features, a few not found in any other BASIC were aware of on any platform. Some of the major features are: * Multiple number formats, including BYTE, INTEGER, LONG, SINGLE and DOUBLE. * Program and variable size is limited only by available RAM. * Optional line numbers. * PRINT USING. * Modern structured statements, like IF-THEN-ELSE and WHILE-WEND. * Disk input and output commands. * Support for types, records and pointers. * True subroutines and functions, with passed parameters and local variables. * Toolbox access, including good support for user tools. * Full screen editor. * Supports ORCA compatible debuggers. Beta Tester Background ---------------------- Beta testers must have the following minimum background and equipment: 1. A familiarity with BASIC. 2. An Apple IIGS with at least 1.125M of RAM and a hard drive. 3. The ability to download binary attachments to e-mail sent over America Online. (You dont need to be on AOL, but beta updates will be sent via AOL.) 4. A mailing address in the US or Canada. Other things that would be a plus are: 1. Already familiar with ORCA languages. 2. Experience at toolbox programming on the Apple IIGS. 3. Experience with pointers and records in Pascal or C. 4. A printer. What You Will Need to Do ------------------------ As a beta tester, you will be asked to: 1. Read about 300 pages of documentation cover to cover in about 2 weeks, making corrections and comments. The annotated pages must be returned to the Byte Works. 2. Try the program on your computer, running our test suite. 3. Write at least one small program from scratch. We dont need the program, we need your comments on GSoft BASIC as you write it. 4. Send your comments and suggestions to us by e-mail. What You Will Get ----------------- We hope you will beta test for the opportunity to shape this new program. In addition, anyone who sends back annotated documentation pages by mail and bug reports by e-mail will receive a commercial copy of GSoft BASIC when it is released, as well as one additional Byte Works product of your choice with a GS-catalog number. We will also publicly acknowledge your contributions in the printed manual--assuming, of course, that we get your comments by the deadline! Time Table ---------- 8 June -- Beta testers will be selected on this date. An initial e-mail will be made on this date, and the documentation will be sent by mail. 22 June -- Annotated documentation must be mailed back to the Byte Works by this date. We will supply a prepaid mailer. 29 June -- Feature freeze. All comments and suggestions that require changes to documentation must be made by this date to stand any chance of appearing in the initial release. 22 July -- GSoft BASIC will be released at Kansas Fest 98. Nondisclosure ------------- Beta testing is a privilege. It is for the benefit of the Byte Works, and later, for the benefit of people who will use the program. All comments and opinions about the program must be kept private, shared only with the Byte Works and the other beta testers, until the planned release date. Anyone who comments on this program publicly in any way, even to the extent of announcing they are a beta tester, before 22 July 1998 will be immediately dropped from the beta test list. They will be asked to return all materials concerning GSoft BASIC to the Byte Works, and will not receive a free commercial copy of the program or an additional product. By applying as a beta tester, you are agreeing to abide by these terms. Beta Test Application --------------------- Personal Name: Street Address: City: State: Zip Code: E-mail: Day Phone: Apple IIGS Information ROM number: RAM: Hard disk? Color monitor? Printer? What kind? Experience Do you know BASIC? Do you know C or Pascal? Do you know assembly language? Do you own ORCA/M? Do you own ORCA/C, ORCA/Pascal or ORCA/Modula-2? Have you ever written a commercial program? Name one or two: Have you ever released a freeware or shareware program? Name one or two: Have you written toolbox programs on the Apple IIGS? Have you been a beta tester for a Byte Works product? Product name: Have you been a beta tester for other products? Name on or two: Is there anything else we should know about you to help us make our choice? (BYTEWORKS, 13029, GO COM A2) SQC'S LAST STAND Below is the inventory of Apple II stuff that Scantron """""""""""""""" Quality Computers still has left. We also have a few odds and ends of hardware (mostly cables) as well as Appleworks - versions 4.3 and 5.1 available. ITEM # DESCRIPTION QTY COST 35141 Ace Explorer Sequencing 2 37 43133 African Rainforest IIGS 1 29 54062 Afterwork Screen Saver 16 19.95 89608 Amazing Mouse 1 27.95 62142 Bake & Taste 2 34.95 43011 Beaglewrite Desk Access 56 6.95 98056 Best of the Internet 1 9 55021 Big Book Maker/Fairy Tales 1 49.95 31174 Billiards & Homonyms 2 29.95 34024 Body in Focus 3 38 48002 busines works 1 112 62168 Chem Aid 2 53 39048 Children's Newspaper Maker 1 39.95 41024 Clip Tunes IIGS 3 24 65292 Clock Apple 2 26.95 35678 Crosswords & Word Find 6 15 62061 Crozzzwords Crossword Puzzles 1 31.95 65298 Dr. Peet's Talk/Writer 1 49.95 40343 Easy as ABC 1 32.95 34170 Exam in a Can/Algebra 1 160 52049 EZ Drive 2 39.95 46526 Fantasy Land Red 1 34.95 46681 Finding Cause and Effect Grade 3 1 22 46536 Fraction-oids 1 1 28.95 53016 Genesys IIGS 1 80 36145 Geographic Jigsaw Puzzle 1 24.95 42634 Granny Applebee's Cookie Factory 1 34.95 40102 Graphics Disk Labeler 7 24 52001 Graphics Exchange 1 35 52044 GSOS System 6 disks only 6 19 52046 GSOS System Dis w/Bundle 19 39 52093 Hometown USA IIGS 1 29 46020 HS Stack - How Bill is law 1 10 98567 Hugo Hounds Vowels 6 29.95 46001 Hyperstudio 3.1 1 112.95 46020 "HyperStudio Stack, How Bill into Law" 1 10 64925 "Hyperstudio, Quick Court Template" 7 39 50101 Jack Nicholas Golf Game 279 19.95 40092 Jack Nicholas Golfe Course #3 287 10 50092 Jack Nicholas Golfe Course #4 99 10 46518 Kinder Critters 8 24.95 46643 "Kittens, Kids & Frogs" 1 47.95 43113 Lockout Apple IIGS 11 39.95 35120 Make a Flash 525 1 44.95 46652 Making Inferences - Grade 5 1 22 56671 Managing a Checking Acct. 1 44 56067 Math Gulper 1 24.95 89603 Math Gulper 1 24.95 96411 Math Shop Fractions 2 59.95 96403 Math Shop Jr. 4 59.95 96405 Math Shop Jr. 12 59.95 45624 Math Word Problems Travel 1 39.95 39003 McGee at the Fun Fair GS 1 29.95 39002 McGee GS 1 29.95 53010 Micol Advanced Basic 3 109 40097 MiniPix 1 7 14.95 40098 MiniPix 2 10 14.95 40099 MiniPix 3 3 14.95 89481 My Words 1 44.95 39343 Once Upon a Time #3 1 34.95 35721 Once Upon a Time II 1 36.95 35722 Once Upon a Time III 2 34.95 35730 Once Upon a Time Playhouse 2 36.95 39333 Once upon a time puppet 12 9 62827 "Once Upon a Time Triple Pk,." 8 32.95 96452 Operation Frog 10 29.95 39231 Orange Cherry Roman 1 32 54039 Outliner 16 42.95 41318 Plantinum Paint Activity Guide 2 24.95 61001 Point to Point 7 59.95 42646 Pondering Problems Grade 4 1 19.95 52322 Prime Suspect Reading 1 29.95 89605 Process Wrot4er 8 79.95 62070 Prodos Update Disk 26 9.95 52038 Program Writer 5 32.95 41315 QC Fong Pak #3 7 19.95 41313 QC Font Pack 11 19 41314 QC Font Pak #2 6 19.95 52051 QC Public Domain 4 12 40125 Quality Print Shop Graphics 1 8 63022 Quarter Mile - Decimals & Percents 1 39.95 63030 Quarter Mile - Value Set 1 144.95 63061 Quarter Mile 4.0 1 41.95 63018 Quarter Mile Fractions 1 39.95 63063 Quarter Mile Whole #'s 1 41.95 52048 RamUp 12 10 65297 Reading for Meaning 2 1 32.95 54043 Repairworks 13 19.95 42588 Rescue in the Outback 1 45 89599 Rudy Reader 1 19.95 52042 Second Chance 2 19 62655 Shop Right! 8 33 52040 Signature GS 1 29.95 39071 Space Shuttle Word Prob. 1 29 56020 Spell It Plus 17 1 39326 Storybook Weeaver 1 47.95 89595 Success with Writing 8 79.95 28411 SuperFonts Fonts Disk 27 0 96340 Superprint II 2 79.95 52073 Switch Hitter 9 29.95 60006 Symbols & Slogans 1 29 52360 System 6.0.1 w/addendum 68 19.95 39073 Talking Clock 2 39.95 39063 Talking Colors & Shapes 5 39.95 39081 Talking First Reader 5 39.95 39087 Talking First Words 1 29 39088 Talking First Words 2 42 39041 Talking Jungle Safari 1 42 39069 Talking Multiplication & Div 1 39.95 39052 Talking School Bus 1 39.95 56027 Talking Sensible Speller 3 109.95 39054 Talking USA Map 1 39.95 98569 Teacher's Puzzle Center 1 79.95 35360 The Bubblegum Machine 6 29.95 38380 The Coin Changer 8 29.95 31170 The Electric Coloring Book 3 39.95 36233 The Oregon Trail 14 39.95 52060 The Presenter 3 42 33301 The Ugly Duckling IIGS 34 10 56665 The Word Problem Game Show 1 44 54060 TO Grammar 2 49.95 54008 TO Power Pack 22 32.95 54009 TO QuickSpell 5 40.95 54018 TO SF Activity 8 32.95 54081 TO Shrinkit Plus 1 19.95 54012 TO Spreadtools 9 40.95 54013 TO Superfonts 4 42.95 54014 TO SuperForms 9 42.95 54017 TO Text Tools 9 32.95 54019 TO Thesaurus 1 32.95 54020 TO UltraMacros 3.1 4 40.95 38381 Tommy the Time Turtle 2 29.95 52039 Triple Dump 16 29.95 98566 Uncle Clyde Consonants 6 39.95 33230 Woolly Bounce 1 39.95 54255 Woolly's Garden 1 39.95 31173 Word Capture 2 29.95 83688 Word Zapper 14 29.95 It looks like it may have come out a little twisted. The first number after the title is the quantity, and the 2nd number is the cost. If it's has no .xx after it, it's an even dollar amount. Hope you can read this. If you can't, please say so! Gina Tech Support PS THERE WILL BE NO TECH SUPPORT on the above items. They are sold as-is (they are new product, however). Tech support on them can be gleaned from either here and/or your local user group or another Apple II expert in your area. Gina (GSAIKIN, 13312, GO COM A2) NINJAFORCE MOVES TO A NEW VIRTUAL HOME """""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" ================= IMPORTANT NOTICE: ================= NINJAFORCE, the makers of various Apple IIGS programs, including the Ninjaforce MEGADEMO and the upcoming KABOOM! have moved to a new web-page: http://www.ninjaforce.home.ml.org While the old address will still be in effect, we highly recommend that you update your bookmarks to our new link. Many greetings, Jesse Blue & Clue / Ninjaforce Check out our upcoming Apple IIGS game at: http://www.ninjaforce.home.ml.org (JESSEBLUE, 13316, GO COM A2) A2 WEBRING UPDATE The Mother of All Apple II Web Rings welcomes Nick """"""""""""""""" Heywood to the fold - when you have a moment, check out Nick's neat concept on how to visually present a web page in a manner familiar to any Apple II user. Here is the complete list of all who have joined the Apple II Web Ring: * A2-Web -- http://www.syndicomm.com/a2web/ * The A2 Forum on Delphi -- http://www.delphi.com/apple2 * The Rhode Island Apple Group Home Page -- http://www.wbwip.com/riag/ * The Apple II Programmers Forum on Delphi -- http://www.delphi.com/a2pro * The AppleWorks Gazette -- http://www.wbwip.com/tag/ * Apple II Software -- http://www.iglou.com/qwerty/kb/dlfiles.html * Marinetti Home Page -- http://www.zip.com.au/~kashum/marinetti * Applebyters of the Quad Cities -- http://helios.augustana.edu/~sbeattie/applebyters/ * The GNO Consortium -- http://www.gno.org * Trenco Apple II FTP Archive -- http://www.gno.org/a2ftp.html * Treasure Chest Project -- http://www.tals.dis.qut.edu.au/staff/willie/treasurechest/ * Shareware Solutions II -- http://www.crl.com/~joko * The Apple II Information Resource -- http://www.apple2.org * Official Home Page of The Lamp! -- http://www.sheppyware.ml.org/~rsuenaga * Annies Craft,Inc. -- http://www.anniescraft.com/ * apple II World -- http://www.gingin.ne.jp/~sckop/apple2/index.html * The Juiced.GS Home Page! -- http://www.wbwip.com/juiced.gs/ * Aurora Area Apple Core -- http://people.delphi.com/hkatz/aaac.html * KFest Homepage -- http://www.primenet.com/~adams/kfest.html * Speccie's Home Pages -- http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/ * Bret's IIgs software -- http://www.cco.caltech.edu/~bret/iigs.html * Apple // Resources -- http://www.iversonsoftware.com/cgi-bin/apple2.cgi * Net Parlour -- http://locals.onslowonline.net/~cracked/index.html * Brutal Deluxe Software Home Page -- http://www.cyberstation.fr/~zardini * Jim Sassman's Homepage -- http://www.binary.net/jsassman/ * alphalink -- http://www.alphalink.com.au/~nickh { Join the Apple II Web Ring!} David K. (DKERWOOD, 13692, GO COM A2) HARDPRESSED RE-RELEASED AS FREEWARE BY AUTHOR According to his post, """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" HardPressed can be downloaded from the A2 Files section on his web site http://www.fadden.com Dave Miller Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller justdave@delphi.com just.dave@genie.com (JUSTDAVE, 13310, GO COM A2) >>>>> I just got email from Andy McFadden saying it's okay to upload """"" HardPressed here and on Genie. I'll upload HardPressed this weekend, and maybe some of the other goodies. If someone else beats me to it, all the better. ----------------------------------------------------- Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5] -- Well feed me bran and call me irregular! (TONYW1, 13330, GO COM A2) BEST OF THE BEST """""""""""""""" 13498 21-JUN 20:04 General Chatter RE: Save The Apple IIgs Page (Re: Msg 13494) From: T_DIAZ To: GUDATH Gus, Shmus! I'm sorry. But I've had it with it. Yes, it was worked on by Apple engineers who have the Apple ][ at heart. Fine. Yes, it was worked on in spare time, then some official time, then banished then worked on again, etc. it's had a hard life. But, to say many times, we're 24 hours from a new release, and then come up with some totally off the wall reason as to why it's not 'ready'. Talk about carrot-ware. Oh, yes, I know strange things can and do happen. I mean, look at Apple. They actually shipped a PowerBook that should have been labeled as a PowerBomb. Capable of bringing down a commercial jetliner in a panic. Someone please tell me, did they ever actually plug one in and charge the battery? I can't belive that got past testing. I Support Bernie 100%, and then some. Take your Apple ][ wherever you want to go, and as fast as you get there. "There's a little ][ in everything we do". Woof Woof! Tony [EOA] [A2P]------------------------------ A2Pro_DUCTIVITY | ----------------------------------- Checking out A2PRO on Delphi """""""""""""""""""""""""""" by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W. [thelamp@delphi.com] 3D RENDERING Well, depending on whether you want just a basic formula for """""""""""" plotting three dimensional points onto a two dimensional display (this I can give you but it only really works for line drawings, you need more code to fill polygons or do texturing), this subject would take an awful lot of space to discuss. However, if anyone would like to teach a course on 3D rendering/animation/whatever, please let me know. :) Jeff Blakeney Dean of A2U (JBLAKENEY, 1795, GO COM A2) >>>>> It would take quite a bit of space to cover 3D rendering properly. """"" There are several good books that do it, though. Depending on your needs, you might be able to use 3D Logo. It uses a 3D version of turtle graphics--you feed it 3D movement information, and it takes care of all of the scaling for you. It even features a red/blue dual drawing mode that, when viewed through 3D glasses (included), shows the image in true 3D! Mike Westerfield (BYTEWORKS, 1797, GO COM A2) >>>>> The best reference for this kind of stuff is _Computer Graphics: """"" Principles and Practice_ by Foley & van Dam. ISBN # on my copy is 0-201-12110-7. Also the _Graphics Gems_ series volumes 1-5 can be useful. Proper 3D rendering is a lot of math, preferably floating point, but can be cheezed on the GS with fixed point. Unless it's really needed, spend the processing time and power on other things. Nathan Mates (NMATES, 1798, GO COM A2) <<<<< I've read the Foley & van Dam book and it is quite good. """"" Unfortunately, now it is more of a primer to teach the basics. There are so many new and better algorithms in use today it is always a good idea to get a more recent book in addition to Foley & van Dam. For instance I have a book that also covers more advanced subjects like ray-tracing and radiosity but doesn't talk much about the basic principles covered in Foley & van Dam. Knowledge of the basics is assumed. > Proper 3D rendering is a lot of math, preferably floating > point, but can be cheezed on the GS with fixed point. > Unless it's really needed, spend the processing time and > power on other things. Very true. I've also thought that the fill mode of the VGC would help speed up drawing as well but I haven't really tried it yet. Too busy with other stuff. Jeff Blakeney (JBLAKENEY, 1800, GO COM A2) SCHEMATICS FOR OLDER II'S The original 'white' Apple II reference, and """"""""""""""""""""""""" the even more distant and rare 'red book', both have a fold out full schematic for the Apple II. There was also a 'SAMS' trouble-shooting reference guide published way back. The original II had 3 Integer Basic ROMS and one monitor ROM leaving one blank ROM socket. The later II+ had 4 Floating Point Basic ROMS and an autostart monitor ROM in the five holders. There were some variants on the boards over the years, but it was mainly only a matter of the memory addressing header blocks, the character generator chip, and one or two extra chips added later. The general schemetic works for all the boards. And you are right in saying that it is filled with 74 series chips... But if there is no video and sound, then it may not actually be starting up. With any venerable Apple II, the first thing you should do is remove all the chips one by one, and clean the pins with a glass fiber eraser or a typewriter hard eraser. That gets 99% of dead Apple II's going... If it still does not work, then you may have some dead chips. The usual cause of this is that someone tried to remove a card while the machine was switched on. That can kill any number of chips anywhere on the board. The worst I ever had was one of the FP Basic chips that got fried. At the time. the Apple II was still in production so I was able to get a replacement, at great cost! Good luck, and keep us all posted to how you get on... Ewen Wannop - Speccie Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5! Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/ (EWANNOP, 1855, GO COM A2) >>>>> As Ewen pointed out, there are a number of sources. Here's one that """"" has the advantage that I can tell you where to get a copy. :) Understanding the Apple II Jim Sather Quality Software We still have these for $14.95. We charge $5 shipping per order in the US and Canada. The books are new (or at least have never been sold!). They include schematics and quite a bit of other information for the hobiest, including maintenance tips with typical problems and solutions. I'll be traveling a lot this month, but if you're in no rush, e-mail me and I'll send you our price list or a printed catalog, whichever you prefer. If you're in a rush, you can call Patty at our office; she can ship one out to you, but may not be able to help with technical questions. Mike Westerfield Byte Works, Inc. (505) 898-8183 (BYTEWORKS, 1904, GO COM A2) GS/OS DIRECTORY STORAGE TYPE I was looking at some of my old directory """""""""""""""""""""""""""" traversal code, and I had made a note that occasionally the GS/OS Open call was returning a storage type of $0E for ProDOS subdirectories. According to the GS/OS Reference, its only supposed to return $0D or $0F for directories. Has anyone else seen this? I'm guessing this is using System 6.0 or 6.0.1. -- Steve Reeves (REEVESST, 1860, GO COM A2) >>>>> The only storageType values I've seen are 0x01, 0x05, 0x0D, and """"" 0x0F. Page 175 of the GS/OS reference doesn't list 0x0F, so I annotated my book with that value. (0x0F is used for volume directories rather than subdirectories.) Perhaps 0x0E was a transcription of a sloppy 0x0F? ie, a typo? Devin (GLYNREADE, 1864, GO COM A2) >>>>> Steve, """"" Do you have any sample code? None of the documentation (TBRs, Sys refs, GS/OS ref) refer to such a storage type, but I seem to remember something about an $0E. Got any code we can look at? Regards, Richard (RICHARD_B, 1866, GO COM A2) >>>>> Storage type $0E is used for subdirectory header entries. """"" Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum (SHEPPY, 1867, GO COM A2) >>>>> So I would guess that the code incorrectly starts at entry $0000 """"" instead of $0001. Interesting. I didn't realise GetDirEntry could return the header entry. Regards, Richard (RICHARD_B, 1868, GO COM A2) >>>>> I'm not sure that GetDirEntry does return the subdirectory header """"" entry (in fact, I don't think it does). Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum (SHEPPY, 1870, GO COM A2) >>>>> Interesting. The GS/OS ref indicates you should start at $0001, but """"" it doesn't mention what happens if you use $0000. I haven't time to test it right now, but perhaps it does. Regards, Richard (RICHARD_B, 1872, GO COM A2) >>>>> I seem to recall getting an error when I accidentally used $0000 """"" for the index. Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum (SHEPPY, 1874, GO COM A2) <<<<< GetDirEntry doesn't return the storage type, only Open and """"" GetFileInfo do. $0E only gets returned rarely, so I wonder if it is a cache issue. Maybe the subdirectory header is in the cache, but the parent directory isn't, so the FST gets the information from the subdirectory header. -- Steve Reeves (REEVESST, 1878, GO COM A2) >>>>> I don't have my Beneath Apple ProDOS handy (it's packed in a box - """"" I'm in the middle of moving) but if I recall correctly from there, $0F is the header entry for a volume, $0E is the header entry for a subdirectory, and $0D is the file entry pointing to a subdirectory. Dave Miller Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller justdave@delphi.com just.dave@genie.com (JUSTDAVE, 1883, GO COM A2) >>>>> Yep. Description on page 4-10 in my copy of Beneath Apple ProDOS, """"" with examples on 4-13 and 4-29. - Aaron (APULVER, 1885, GO COM A2) TRENCO.GNO.ORG--MAJOR A2 FTP SITE IN THE MAKING As many people know, the """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""" GNO Consortium is now providing a general Apple II ftp archive. There are policies in place regarding piracy and similiar issues. The url is ftp://ftp.gno.org/pub/apple2 http://www.gno.org There is an /incoming directory, and (non-pirated) uploads are fine. If you have questions regarding the policies, there is a policy document available for download or web viewing. Devin (GLYNREADE, 1863, GO COM A2) SPREADSHEETS ON DEMAND I have a project in mind that I've been wanting to """""""""""""""""""""" do for quite some time (years!). I've started it many times, and actually made progress, but would hit a programming snag that would prevent me from making it "perfect" (or as close a perfect can be in the programming world! ;-) ). It would then slip to the back-burner, and then sooner or later I would take another crack at it, having the same results. I've now 'bragged' at work that I can do this, and they've saddled me with the project. I'm not on a real tight time frame to finish this project, but I would like to start making some real progress on it. I imagine that, since I'm no programmer, this will seem a simple task to most here, but would appreciate any help. I considered posting this in A2, but feel that it belongs here. If someone disagrees, I'll be happy to move it to A2. The issue, in its' simpleist description, is creating a spreadsheet that calculates time worked, money earned for that time, etc. The interface needs to be simple enough where any user, computer illiterate or not, can simply enter the start time and end time of a shift in decimal form (i.e. 8.2 starting time = 08:12 in real time). At work, I'm using MS Excel (since I don't have a choice), but for the purpose here, any A2gs spreadsheet program will be fine. I'd prefer using "Quick Clic Calc", but would settle on AWGS Spreadsheet module (although I don't really trust it!). Here are the issues. Since all of the items needed (with clear descriptions) will not fit on this screen, I'll list all of the columns needed that I have already created... Name, Status, Scheduled Shift Start, Scheduled Shift End, Actual Shift Start, Actual Shift End, Staight Time, Overtime, Doubletime, Total time, OT/DT Approved By:, Shift Premium, Lead, General Foreman, High Pay, Lunch time, Penalty time, Money due for Penalty, Comments. These all seem simple entries at first glance, but most of them imply various "background" calculations that can get quite complex. So, my question is, is this an appropriate place for this type of discussion? Shall I proceed with an explanation of problems that I've not been able to resolve? Thanks for listening, Jeff Carr Cruising the 'rainbow' path provided by: Spectrum v2.1 and Crock O' Gold v2.5 (LUMITECH, 1873, GO COM A2) >>>>> I'll list the 'Columns' needed again, define them, and then one can """"" refer back to them as needed... Name, Status, Scheduled Shift Start, Scheduled Shift End, Actual Shift Start, Actual Shift End, Staight Time, Overtime, Doubletime, Total time, OT/DT Approved By:, Shift Premium, Lead, General Foreman, High Pay, Lunch time, Penalty time, Money due for Penalty, Comments. Name = Employee Name To eventually be put into a lookup table, but for now can be ignored. Status = 02 (highest) to 08 (lowest) with a 'no entry' being a temporary employee. This could be part of the 'Name' lookup table, but I need it displayed in a separate column. This also determines the 'Base Rate of Pay', probably needed in a lookup table. Scheduled Shift Start = Scheduled Start Time for the named employee. Frequently, shifts change at the last moment, hence the requirement for 'Actual Shift Start'. The entry format needs to be in decimal form, i.e. "8.2" equals 08:12am, 23.0 = 11:00pm, etc. Scheduled Shift End = Same requirements as 'Scheduled Shift Start' above. Actual Shift Start = Same requirements as 'Scheduled Shift Start' above. Actual Shift End = Same requirements as 'Scheduled Shift Start' above. Straight Time (ST) = Total time between 'Shift Start' and 'Shift End' after subtracting 'Lunch Time' (below) from the total. If there are no entries in the 'Actual' fields, then the 'Scheduled' fields are assumed. Also, if the total exceeds '8.0' hours, the remainder needs to list in the 'OT' column. If the 'OT' column exceeds '4.0' hours, the remainder needs to list in the 'DT' column. Overtime (OT) = Any 'time' that exceeds 8.0 hours in the 'ST' column. Again, if the 'OT' column exceeds 4.0 hours, the remainder goes to the 'DT' column. Doubeltime (DT) = Any 'time' that exceeds 4.0 hours in the 'OT' column. Total Time (TT) = Totals of 'ST', 'OT', and 'DT', again, in decimal format. OT/DT Approved By: = Initials of a particular supervisor, provided by a 'lookup' table. Shift Premium = If equal to '1', no premium if between the hours of 5.0 to 15.9. If equal to '2', a premium of $.25 is used between the hours of 16.0 to 21.9. If equal to '3', a premium of $.40 is used between the hours of 22.0 to 5.0. Again, if 'Actual Start Time' is empty, then 'Scheduled Start Time' is assumed. These rates should probably go into a lookup table also, as these rates change with each new contract (about every 3 years). Lead = A $.75 premium/hour is paid for all hours listed in this column. (A lookup table again?) General Foreman = A $1.15 premium/hour is paid for all hours listed in in this column. (A lookup table again?) High Pay = Think of this as 'danger' pay. A $2.40 premium/hour is paid for all hours listed in this column. (A lookup table again?) Lunch Time = A column to notate how long the employee was on lunch, to be deducted from the 'ST' column before listing. Penalty Time = If this entry is empty, no penalty time was permitted. If this column has an entry, $20/hr added for each .5/hr listed. Money Due for Penalty = Total of calculation from the 'Penalty Time' column. (A lookup table again?) Comments = Simply a field to enter explanation if any of the above does not meet the criteria, i.e. if 'Scheduled Start Time' does not match the 'Actual Start Time' (if an employee is 'late', 'sick', went home early, etc.). This should easily get us started. ;-) Perhaps the way to approach this is 'one-by-one'. The name and status columns =probably= require a large 'lookup' table, so let's skip that for now. The area I've had the most problems with is letting the computer do the time calculations accurately. To explain, let me point out where I've stumbled in trying to make this work. One would initially think that a simple '=sum(End Time - Start Time)' would generate the proper entry in ST; in many cases it would, i.e. End Time = 23.5 and Start Time = 15.0, then ST = 8.0 after subtracting .5 for lunch. However, if the employee's Start Time = 23.0 and their End Time = 06.5, then a negative number is realized, leaving the =very= poor employee owing money to the employer! So, if agreed, can we work on this problem first? I've =toyed= with using 'ABS' in the spreadsheet to avoid the negative number, but I continue to get inconsistent totals. If I were using Basic, I'd write it like this... Let X = Start Time Let Y = End Time If X>Y then ST=X-Y : ST=Y-X ST=ST - Lunch Time If ST>8.0 then OT=ST-8.0 : ST=8.0 : If OT>4.0 then DT=OT-4.0 : OT=4.0 TT=ST+OT+DT Keep in mind that the above calculation is based on 'Scheduled Start/End Times' =unless= 'Actual Start/End Times' are entered. If there are entries in the 'Actual' columns, then the 'Scheduled' columns are ignored. Now, help me get that into a spreadsheet calculation and we'll move onto some more interesting 'logic' fiascos! Jeff Carr Cruising the 'rainbow' path provided by: Spectrum v2.1 and Crock O' Gold v2.5 (LUMITECH, 1891, GO COM A2) >>>>> Since you are using 24 hr. time, shouldn't be too hard. """"" 1.) First we need to figure out the total time worked, using either scheduled time or actual time. Ideally the formula would be like this: (in pseudo-AWGS SpreadSheet format) =If( IsEmpty( actual time ),( =If( sched end > sched start, sched end - sched start - lunch , 24 - sched start + sched end - lunch)),( =If( actual end > actual start, actual end - actual start - lunch, 24 - sched start + sched end - Lunch))) But since AWGS can't handle the nested functions, it needs to be broken down into multiple cells. Total time cell function: note: replace actual start, temp sched & temp actual with relative cells =If(IsEmpty(actual start), temp sched, temp actual) temp sched cell function: note: replace sched end, sched start & lunch with relative cells =If(sched end > sched start, sched end - sched start - lunch, 24 - sched start + sched end) temp actual cell function: note: replace actual end, actual start & lunch with relative cells =If(actual end > actual start, actual end - actual start - lunch, 24 - actual start + actual end) note: when a shift crosses the 24 hr boundry, subtract start time from 24, then add the end time. example start 23.5; end 8.0 subtract 23.5 from 24 gives you .5, then add 8.0 gives you 8.5, then subtract .5 for lunch and you have 8.0 hrs worked. Once you have total time figured, it is easy to figure ST, OT and DT. =If(total time > 8.0, 8.0, total time) will give you ST. You can do OT and DT. See ya. HABANERO (HABANERO, 1893, GO COM A2) >>>>> I happen to have a spreedsheet in ***** (um, it's evil, so I won't """"" say which program :) that does time calculations on hours worked crossing midnight. Mine is mostly for scheduling, rather than payroll, but the concept is the same... In this example, C7 is the start time, and C8 is the end time... I let the spreadsheet software do the time conversions to and from decimal, as I have the format of those cells set so I type in real times with the colon in the middle. The place of business I use this to write schedules for requires a half hour lunch if an employee works more than 5 hours, so it will subtract a half hour from the total if there's more than 5 hours. If cell B9 contains "NL" it means that employee was authorized to not have to take lunches, so it doesn't subtract the half hour in that case. It does correct for having the shift cross midnight... =IF(OR(ISBLANK(C7), ISBLANK(C8)), "", IF(C8 >= C7, IF(OR((C8 - C7) <= TIMEVALUE("5:00"), $B9 = "NL"), C8 - C7, C8 - C7 - TIMEVALUE("0:30")), IF(OR((C8 + 1) - C7 <= TIMEVALUE("5:00"), $B9 = "NL"), (C8 + 1)-C7, (C8+1)-C7-TIMEVALUE("0:30")))) If I remove the half hour lunch thing, so all we're looking at is correcting for a shift crossing midnight, it leaves this: =IF(OR(ISBLANK(C7), ISBLANK(C8)), "", IF(C8 >= C7, C8 - C7, (C8 + 1)-C7)) C8 + 1 in this case is because the software in question records time as a fraction of a day, so adding 1 to the end time is the equivalent of adding 24 hours to the end time. Dave Miller Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller justdave@delphi.com just.dave@genie.com (JUSTDAVE, 1898, GO COM A2) >>>>> "But since AWGS can't handle the nested functions, it needs to be """"" broken down into multiple cells." I haven't had any problems getting AWGS to do nested functions. Just drop the = signs. The function isn't =IF(), it's IF(). The = is there so it knows that cell contains a formula and not a value. Dave Miller Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller justdave@delphi.com just.dave@genie.com (JUSTDAVE, 1903, GO COM A2) >>>>> Right you are. The ='s were left there as a mistake when I cut and """"" pasted into Crock o' Gold. , quick hacks at 04:00 can lead to many mistakes and your message made me go back and try my original formula again. It wasn't that AWGS couldn't handle the nested functions (as the error message lead me to believe) it was a typo on my part, mismatched ()'s on one of the nested If's, d'oh! The REAL formula goes into the Total Time cell like this: =If(IsEmpty(e3),If(d3>c3,d3-c3-p3,24-c3+d3-p3),If(f3>e3,f3-e3-p3,24-e3+f3-p 3)) where c3 = sched start, d3 = sched end, e3 = actual start, f3 = actual end and p3 = lunch. This would be typed into cell j3, which would be total time per Jeff's specs. Anybody reading my original post, ignore the part about having to split it into multiple cells, although that works too :o) HABANERO (HABANERO, 1905, GO COM A2) [EOA] [KFE]------------------------------ THINKING KFEST | ----------------------------------- KANSASFEST ON THE WEB """"""""""""""""""""" by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W. [thelamp@delphi.com] A VIRTUAL KFEST ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Steve Gozdziewski, also known as Steve Godzilla, has spent his spare time the last three years helping to organize KansasFest. Painstakingly he has etched out schedule of events after schedule of events and dealt with last minute cancellations, mid-stream additions, and all manner of calamity. A thankless job indeed, as it is unlikely there has ever been a KFest schedule everyone has been happy with, yet, he says today the same thing he did after his first KFest: "I want every Apple II user to come to KansasFest, at least once." An ambitious goal for sure, and one I share in as well, but unquestionably there will likely always be the person who for some reason or another never makes it to Avila's hallowed halls. While the Apple II advocate in me screams out to tell you to do whatever you can to come, there will always be those who cannot make it. If you fall into this category, what's the next best thing? The answer: KansasFest on the web! There are several sites on the World Wide Web which promote or review or otherwise provide coverage of the Apple II event of the year. If you're stuck at home in mid-July rather than sweating it out in Kansas City, perhaps viewing these sites will satisfy your Apple II urge for this year. The Official KansasFest Web Page lives at: http://www.primenet.com/~adams/kfest.html You'll find all the basics of KFest information right here, from where to sign up (and an online sign up form) to dates, locations, names, mailing list info. . . you name it, it's right here. David Kerwood, the prodigious DiveMaster, is the webmaster for this site. While it's well-known that KFest attendees tend to only use the word "sleep" followed by the words "what's that", many people don't realize that in addition to having fun, real work is taking place. The aforementioned David Kerwood spent much of his time at the last two KFests giving updated reports to the world at large via the A2-Web page. The URL for viewing these is: http://www.syndicomm.com/a2web/kfest.html One of the real Kansans who finally made his way to KFest this past year was Kirk Mitchell, a member of the A2 Geek Gang. Kirk had so much fun at KFest '97 he took a bunch of pictures with his digital camera and uploaded them to his Web page, then got blatantly plugged in the major Apple II publications, so he spruced things up a little. You can see his work at: http://moscow2.pld.com/kfest97/ Geoff Weiss was relatively anonymous back at KFest '96, before he became relatively famous as the co-author of _Spectrum Internet Suite_, the seed of which was planted at Avila College. Prior to _SIS_ making it out the door, Geoff wrote a review of KansasFest '96 and posted it on his Web page. Check it out at: http://www.gwlink.net/geoff/kf96.html There are other KFest Web pages around the world, for sure, as well as reviews in the Apple II publications (including _GenieLamp A2_). And there is always fun mail on the KFest Mailing List, which we've discussed in this column in the past. If you're looking for more KFest on the World Wide Web, I suggest you use the links from the pages above. If you choose to, you can use an Internet search engine like snap.com; searching on the term "kansasfest" will net you much better results than searching on "kfest". Finally, I'd like to remind you that the best virtual KFest is not virtual at all--it's actually being at Avila to see hardware that was never made, programs that could never be done, and celebrate the computer that started it all: the Apple II. Join us while you still can. Every KFest needs to be treated like it's the last--celebrate the Apple II like there's no tomorrow. Apple II Forever! :: DISCUSSED ON DELPHI :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: : : : When in doubt, make it configurable. : : : :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: GOLDFISCHE ::: [EOA] [INN]------------------------------ EXTRA INNINGS | ----------------------------------- About The Lamp! The Lamp! is published on the fifteenth of every month in """"""""""""""" the Database of the II Scribe Forum on the Delphi online service (GO CUS 11). This publication produced entirely with real or emulated Apple II computers using Appleworks 5.1 and Hermes. Apple II Forever! * The Lamp! is (c) copyright 1998 by Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W. All rights reserved. * To reach The Lamp! on Internet email send mail to thelamp@delphi.com. * Back issues of The Lamp! are available in the II Scribe Forum on Delphi as well as The Lamp! Home Page, http://lamp.sheppyware.net. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Opinions expressed herein are those of the individual authors, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of the Delphi Online Services, Syndicomm, Inc., or Ryan M. Suenaga. Forum messages are reprinted verbatim and are included in this publication with permission from the individual authors. Delphi Online Services, Syndicomm, Inc. and Ryan M. Suenaga do not guarantee the accuracy or suitability of any information included herein. We reserve the right to edit all letters and copy. Material published in this edition may not be reprinted without the expressed written consent of the publisher. Registered computer user groups, not for profit publications , and other interested parties may write the publisher to apply for permission to reprint any or all material. <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< [EOF]